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Master Disaster

Dr Disrespect is banned from Twitch for streaming from the men's toilet at E3

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Posted · Original PosterOP
17 hours ago, Tristerin said:

OK and Illegal are two different things.  It is illegal to record someone in a restroom - likely charges are worse once asked not to - I.E. Trespassing charges as well can be levied by the property owner.  Im not a police officer but work directly with local task forces, and you likely aren't an officer either (or your response would have been more educated along the lines of how the law works)

 

Now, topic is wrong unless Dr. Disrespect himself was holding the camera.  If he wasn't than its only the cameraman that is liable.

Recording in a public toilet is illegal and ftr you're the one claiming it's only an invasion of privacy if he ignores a request to stop doing it

 

I'm pretty sure Twitch disagrees with your conclusion that only the cameraman is liable as he is still banned from the service.


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21 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

I don't think this is quite correct. In most criminal law, if you're an accessory to a crime, you're usually still guilty - though perhaps of a lesser offense.

 

In this case, while the camera man was the one technically doing the "filming", he was doing so at the behest of Dr Disrespect, who lead him into the bathroom to begin with.

 

I would suspect they would both be guilty, if this went to court.

Guilty as an accessory.  If he did not ask the cameraman to follow him, he also does not have to tell him not to go into the bathroom.  Its the courts ability or inability to prove a crime was committed by the good Dr.  Im not sure there is proof on that video.

 

At someones behest is the same as saying if I jump off that bridge will you?  Not the same thing at all.  And if the good Dr ordered his employee to do this, that may be different - but neither of us are criminal justice lawyers - the only thing I do is work with police daily as the local precincts combative instructor.


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17 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

Recording in a public toilet is illegal and ftr you're the one claiming it's only an invasion of privacy if he ignores a request to stop doing it

 

I'm pretty sure Twitch disagrees with your conclusion that only the cameraman is liable as he is still banned from the service.

Twitch isn't the law.  At all but sure the social courts find him guilty.

 

Bet he isn't convicted.  He isn't recording.


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10 minutes ago, Tristerin said:

Guilty as an accessory.  If he did not ask the cameraman to follow him, he also does not have to tell him not to go into the bathroom.  Its the courts ability or inability to prove a crime was committed by the good Dr.  Im not sure there is proof on that video.

 

At someones behest is the same as saying if I jump off that bridge will you?  Not the same thing at all.  And if the good Dr ordered his employee to do this, that may be different - but neither of us are criminal justice lawyers - the only thing I do is work with police daily as the local precincts combative instructor.

The difference is that even after entering the bathroom, he still participated directly in the filming/streaming. It wasn’t just the cameraman following him like he had no idea the cameraman was there. 

 

Yes neither of us are lawyers. But I can make an educated guess here. 


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6 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

The difference is that even after entering the bathroom, he still participated directly in the filming/streaming. It wasn’t just the cameraman following him like he had no idea the cameraman was there. 

 

Yes neither of us are lawyers. But I can make an educated guess here. 

I would call that uneducated.  I work with law enforcement 5 days a week.  So I will say that my understanding of approaching a situation to dictate when a crime occurs (or when less than lethal force is allowed by Law) since I am a combatives instructor in one of my business' (intellectual knowledge is the best thing to sell btw) is educated.

 

The Good Dr enters a bathroom

Behind him enters a man with a Camera recording

Law broken by man recording (Police only allowed to ask him to leave the area and give up the phone because the evidence on it while arrest or detainment occurs)(if he does not comply, use of force can escalate)

Man recording continues to follow, and respond to man that entered before him

The only potential crime levied at this point is Disturbing the Peace via Dr Disrespect. (cant just tackle him for this as a cop either)

 

EDIT - and to clarify there are no cops present, Im just telling you when the crime has occurred.  I work with our Constables On Patrol and it is my greatest desire to give them the ability to use less than lethal tactics instead of a gun, and also work with them on escalation (they give me the escalation points, I give them the combatives response)


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1 hour ago, Tristerin said:

I would call that uneducated.  I work with law enforcement 5 days a week.  So I will say that my understanding of approaching a situation to dictate when a crime occurs (or when less than lethal force is allowed by Law) since I am a combatives instructor in one of my business' (intellectual knowledge is the best thing to sell btw) is educated.

 

The Good Dr enters a bathroom

Behind him enters a man with a Camera recording

Law broken by man recording (Police only allowed to ask him to leave the area and give up the phone because the evidence on it while arrest or detainment occurs)(if he does not comply, use of force can escalate)

Man recording continues to follow, and respond to man that entered before him

The only potential crime levied at this point is Disturbing the Peace via Dr Disrespect. (cant just tackle him for this as a cop either)

 

EDIT - and to clarify there are no cops present, Im just telling you when the crime has occurred.  I work with our Constables On Patrol and it is my greatest desire to give them the ability to use less than lethal tactics instead of a gun, and also work with them on escalation (they give me the escalation points, I give them the combatives response)

You're completely ignoring the fact that Dr disrespect continued to use the camera (he is paying for) and film himself (even though someone else was operating the camera under his instruction and most likely being paid for it) in a place he is not allowed to.  I think your grasp on this is very tenuous at best.  


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12 hours ago, Tristerin said:

I would call that uneducated.  I work with law enforcement 5 days a week.  So I will say that my understanding of approaching a situation to dictate when a crime occurs (or when less than lethal force is allowed by Law) since I am a combatives instructor in one of my business' (intellectual knowledge is the best thing to sell btw) is educated.

 

The Good Dr enters a bathroom

Behind him enters a man with a Camera recording

Law broken by man recording (Police only allowed to ask him to leave the area and give up the phone because the evidence on it while arrest or detainment occurs)(if he does not comply, use of force can escalate)

Man recording continues to follow, and respond to man that entered before him

The only potential crime levied at this point is Disturbing the Peace via Dr Disrespect. (cant just tackle him for this as a cop either)

 

EDIT - and to clarify there are no cops present, Im just telling you when the crime has occurred.  I work with our Constables On Patrol and it is my greatest desire to give them the ability to use less than lethal tactics instead of a gun, and also work with them on escalation (they give me the escalation points, I give them the combatives response)

 

11 hours ago, mr moose said:

You're completely ignoring the fact that Dr disrespect continued to use the camera (he is paying for) and film himself (even though someone else was operating the camera under his instruction and most likely being paid for it) in a place he is not allowed to.  I think your grasp on this is very tenuous at best.  

I agree with @mr moose's assessment. @Tristerin I respect greatly that you work directly with law enforcement in training them on threat escalation, etc - but I feel like you're letting that interfere with otherwise extremely sound judgement on your part.

 

This is more of a lawyer/attorney/judge area of expertise, and while a police officer would definitely have some knowledge of the subject, they are not the experts either.

 

The reason why Dr Disrespect (herein called DrDis, because I can't be assed to type out his full username every time) would be an accessory in my opinion is just as Moose said. The camera operator is following DrDis around, as per his job. DrDis knew he was streaming. He knew he was going into a bathroom. And therefore it's logical to assume he knew the cameraman would follow him.

 

He doesn't have to explicitly tell the cameraman, because it's implied as part of the dude's job. He kept up the "act" of being "live and streaming" throughout the entire process even as he entered the bathroom.

 

It would be like if I drove some bank robbers (in full bank robber getup, with guns and gear) to a bank, watched them rob the bank, then they got into my car and I drove home. I didn't ask them to rob the bank specifically, but unless there were some very extenuating circumstances, I'd likely be guilty by association. I could reasonably tell they were bank robbers, and I could reasonably infer after the fact that they robbed the bank.

 

Could DrDis get off on a technicality? Sure? Maybe. Worse things have happened in the court room. But in my humble opinion, he's guilty by association, since the cameraman would have zero reason to be filming period (let alone in a bathroom) with him being a streamer streaming that day.

 

The entire crew (which would include DrDis plus the cameraman, plus any other ancillary crew members directly involved in the streaming process, like audio guys, etc) that entered the bathroom would be guilty, in my opinion.

 

The cameraman might face the brunt of the legal action, but DrDis, in my opinion, is still guilty to some degree.


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15 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

police officer would definitely have some knowledge of the subject, they are not the experts either.

This is absolutely correct.  Police are not there to interpret the law, just enforce it. 


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Just now, Velcade said:

This is absolutely correct.  Police are not there to interpret the law, just enforce it. 

Exactly my point. Agreed. While they can and often are very knowledgeable of the law, nuanced situations like this are not up to them to determine guilt. That would be the AG or the Crown, etc (in the US I'd assume this would be the AG, but I don't claim to be an expert on US law and how the entire system works).


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6 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

 

I agree with @mr moose's assessment. @Tristerin I respect greatly that you work directly with law enforcement in training them on threat escalation, etc - but I feel like you're letting that interfere with otherwise extremely sound judgement on your part.

 

This is more of a lawyer/attorney/judge area of expertise, and while a police officer would definitely have some knowledge of the subject, they are not the experts either.

 

The reason why Dr Disrespect (herein called DrDis, because I can't be assed to type out his full username every time) would be an accessory in my opinion is just as Moose said. The camera operator is following DrDis around, as per his job. DrDis knew he was streaming. He knew he was going into a bathroom. And therefore it's logical to assume he knew the cameraman would follow him.

 

He doesn't have to explicitly tell the cameraman, because it's implied as part of the dude's job. He kept up the "act" of being "live and streaming" throughout the entire process even as he entered the bathroom.

 

It would be like if I drove some bank robbers (in full bank robber getup, with guns and gear) to a bank, watched them rob the bank, then they got into my car and I drove home. I didn't ask them to rob the bank specifically, but unless there were some very extenuating circumstances, I'd likely be guilty by association. I could reasonably tell they were bank robbers, and I could reasonably infer after the fact that they robbed the bank.

 

Could DrDis get off on a technicality? Sure? Maybe. Worse things have happened in the court room. But in my humble opinion, he's guilty by association, since the cameraman would have zero reason to be filming period (let alone in a bathroom) with him being a streamer streaming that day.

 

The entire crew (which would include DrDis plus the cameraman, plus any other ancillary crew members directly involved in the streaming process, like audio guys, etc) that entered the bathroom would be guilty, in my opinion.

 

The cameraman might face the brunt of the legal action, but DrDis, in my opinion, is still guilty to some degree.

 

More to the point, DrD was streaming to his own twitch account, so when he continued to talk to the camera in the bathroom, he engaged in said illegal activity without pause and to his own financial gain.  In my mind there is no question, he committed a crime and to be honest, I think the camera man is the accessory.

 


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Best part about all of you who don't work with law enforcement - he still isn't charged with shit...gee I wonder why.

 

Twitch isn't the law, its a Company and he is being barred from that, and not charged with anything...because...………………………………(in comes those who seem to be the "most educated")

 

Do you guys think this global news isn't known to law enforcement?  Do you think that those people in the bathroom aren't trying to get SOMETHING done to him?  Because if he broke the law, live streaming, than that's all the proof you need.  Or did HE break a law?  In comes those "more educated".  Im not guessing here, Im just stating the moments that matter to when a law is broken.

 

Ill gladly wait a month and necro res this thread when he still doesn't get charged with anything.  Charging and conviction is not the same thing - but Im a betting man, and he wont be charged because there isn't "sufficient evidence" of HIM breaking the law.


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2 hours ago, Tristerin said:

Best part about all of you who don't work with law enforcement - he still isn't charged with shit...gee I wonder why.

 

Twitch isn't the law, its a Company and he is being barred from that, and not charged with anything...because...………………………………(in comes those who seem to be the "most educated")

 

Do you guys think this global news isn't known to law enforcement?  Do you think that those people in the bathroom aren't trying to get SOMETHING done to him?  Because if he broke the law, live streaming, than that's all the proof you need.  Or did HE break a law?  In comes those "more educated".  Im not guessing here, Im just stating the moments that matter to when a law is broken.

 

Ill gladly wait a month and necro res this thread when he still doesn't get charged with anything.  Charging and conviction is not the same thing - but Im a betting man, and he wont be charged because there isn't "sufficient evidence" of HIM breaking the law.

 

Whether he gets charged or not is irrelevant.  Many law breakers don't get charged for more reasons than I care to even think about.  However seeing as you are so adamant that teaching self defense = having law degree,  then in a month or two I expect to see you necro this thread and continue arguing your ideals.

 

 


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Posted · Original PosterOP
5 hours ago, Tristerin said:

Best part about all of you who don't work with law enforcement - he still isn't charged with shit...gee I wonder why.

 

Twitch isn't the law, its a Company and he is being barred from that, and not charged with anything...because...………………………………(in comes those who seem to be the "most educated")

 

Do you guys think this global news isn't known to law enforcement?  Do you think that those people in the bathroom aren't trying to get SOMETHING done to him?  Because if he broke the law, live streaming, than that's all the proof you need.  Or did HE break a law?  In comes those "more educated".  Im not guessing here, Im just stating the moments that matter to when a law is broken.

 

Ill gladly wait a month and necro res this thread when he still doesn't get charged with anything.  Charging and conviction is not the same thing - but Im a betting man, and he wont be charged because there isn't "sufficient evidence" of HIM breaking the law.

You built your own strawman, gave it a heart and set it free

 

Who here claimed Twitch are responsible for law enforcement? We're discussing him being banned from Twitch, it was mentioned that it's probably illegal and he could be liable for something criminal but the main topic of this discussion is Twitch and his ban.

 

It wasn't until you claimed it's only a privacy invasion if he ignores someone asking him to stop that the discussion moved to focus on the police and criminal charges.

 

He's guilty of breaching Twitchs ToS and as such was banned from the platform, anything beyond that is nothing but speculation.


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9 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

You built your own strawman, gave it a heart and set it free

 

Who here claimed Twitch are responsible for law enforcement? We're discussing him being banned from Twitch, it was mentioned that it's probably illegal and he could be liable for something criminal but the main topic of this discussion is Twitch and his ban.

 

It wasn't until you claimed it's only a privacy invasion if he ignores someone asking him to stop that the discussion moved to focus on the police and criminal charges.

 

He's guilty of breaching Twitchs ToS and as such was banned from the platform, anything beyond that is nothing but speculation.

Agreed - and furthermore to that, the Cameraman hasn't been charged either (to my knowledge), and there's literally twitch stream video evidence that the camera was streaming and recording, along with dozens of witnesses who can identify him, so that guy is guilty for sure.

 

As @mr moose said, often times people who are guilty (or there's reasonable evidence that they're guilty) won't get charged. There are hundreds of possible reasons for this, including the prosecutors simply not bothering with a small time case (assuming none of the people in the bathroom made a complaint to law enforcement) when they're too busy with other more important cases.

 

So if he comes back in a month and necro's the thread, hopefully he checks to see if the cameraman was charged too .


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18 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

It wasn't until you claimed it's only a privacy invasion if he ignores someone asking him to stop that the discussion moved to focus on the police and criminal charges.

 

Also you in the same page I posted (page 4):

"Yes what he did is illegal under California Law and it turns out he was also banned from E3 as well..."

 

MY post not notated at anyone, just discussing the law on a forum about computers, after you bring up law - but not talking to you or anyone else just voicing my opinion:

There is an expectation of Privacy by Law in America in the bathroom.

 

If he was never asked to stop recording by anyone (I don't have time to watch the video) and was doing this act very obviously - than Im not sure how local laws will play out.

 

If someone asked him to stop recording, and he didn't, than he has violated that persons privacy, and could be sued but under what law Im not sure - because he showed the world their private moments in a legally private place and was asked to cease his activities.

 

In comes @dalekphalm to argue with me moments later. (this is all recorded here on this forum yet...)

Then @Master Disaster @'s me

And you all buddy buddy up like Im the problem 

 

So we discuss the law because YOU ALL wanted to.

 

Funny huh.

 

EDIT - damn I went to page 3 and you lot were discussing law there too. 

 


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1 hour ago, Tristerin said:

Also you in the same page I posted (page 4):

"Yes what he did is illegal under California Law and it turns out he was also banned from E3 as well..."

 

MY post not notated at anyone, just discussing the law on a forum about computers, after you bring up law - but not talking to you or anyone else just voicing my opinion:

There is an expectation of Privacy by Law in America in the bathroom.

 

If he was never asked to stop recording by anyone (I don't have time to watch the video) and was doing this act very obviously - than Im not sure how local laws will play out.

 

If someone asked him to stop recording, and he didn't, than he has violated that persons privacy, and could be sued but under what law Im not sure - because he showed the world their private moments in a legally private place and was asked to cease his activities.

 

In comes @dalekphalm to argue with me moments later. (this is all recorded here on this forum yet...)

Then @Master Disaster @'s me

And you all buddy buddy up like Im the problem 

 

So we discuss the law because YOU ALL wanted to.

 

Funny huh.

 

EDIT - damn I went to page 3 and you lot were discussing law there too. 

 

I think you're conflating things.

 

Yes, I 100% believe what he did was illegal. No, he hasn't been convicted (nor even charged - not that there's any guarantee he will be charged even if it was an illegal act).

 

But our main point still stands, we respect the fact that you work with law enforcement, helping to train them. But you don't train them on legal matters like this. This is not your area of expertise, just like it isn't ours.

 

I work IT at a Public Library - I work very closely with Librarians, archivists, gallery art directors, etc. But just because I train them on how to view Email (Or in your case - something to do with self defense and/or threat escalation/de-escalation), doesn't mean I have intimate knowledge of document archiving.

 

The only reason this discussion turned sour is because you disagreed with our assessment (which is 100% okay), but then started to dismiss our arguments because "you work with law enforcement" on a daily basis. That was the moment this discussion started to fall apart.

 

At this point, I'm bowing out. You don't seem to be interested in discussing possibilities about how DrDis himself might be guilty of a crime (either directly or by association), and you keep throwing the fact that you work with law enforcement at us as if that disqualifies our points (it doesn't).

 

And then you threatened to necro the thread to essentially "rub it in" if it turns out we were wrong.

 

So yeah. I'm out.


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Posted · Original PosterOP
3 hours ago, Tristerin said:

Also you in the same page I posted (page 4):

"Yes what he did is illegal under California Law and it turns out he was also banned from E3 as well..."

 

MY post not notated at anyone, just discussing the law on a forum about computers, after you bring up law - but not talking to you or anyone else just voicing my opinion:

There is an expectation of Privacy by Law in America in the bathroom.

 

If he was never asked to stop recording by anyone (I don't have time to watch the video) and was doing this act very obviously - than Im not sure how local laws will play out.

 

If someone asked him to stop recording, and he didn't, than he has violated that persons privacy, and could be sued but under what law Im not sure - because he showed the world their private moments in a legally private place and was asked to cease his activities.

 

In comes @dalekphalm to argue with me moments later. (this is all recorded here on this forum yet...)

Then @Master Disaster @'s me

And you all buddy buddy up like Im the problem 

 

So we discuss the law because YOU ALL wanted to.

 

Funny huh.

 

EDIT - damn I went to page 3 and you lot were discussing law there too. 

 

Also me...

20 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

Who here claimed Twitch are responsible for law enforcement? We're discussing him being banned from Twitch, it was mentioned that it's probably illegal and he could be liable for something criminal but the main topic of this discussion is Twitch and his ban.

 


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20 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

Also me...

 

After...after all the other things.  Im just glad this timeline is in place, that no matter how much you want...started with...you and Troop C.


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