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g g d h

Passive cooling with a... floor \(o)-(o)/

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Posted Original PosterOP

Sup... first post. Be gentle聽馃槼

I got into watercooling聽quite some time ago. Got my first WCed rig (8800GT SLI) way back in uhm... 2006 and ever since i never had any air cooler on my CPUs / GPUs聽馃槑

Currently sitting on an i7-2600K (quite OK unit聽>>5GHz @ 4C/8T ezy pzy<<, got it from an overclocker from XtremeSystems who got it to 5.5GHz on LN2) and a GTX780 both sitting on MSI P67a-GD65 with 8GB RAM and bunch of drives. All in a BitFenix Shinobi XL with Thermochill PA360.3 (any old timer still remembers it and how much cooling potential it has?) and an EK 240 thick radiator (don't remember the exact model), XSPC RASA slapped on CPU and FC EK waterblock on a GPU. Oh... and i still have unused and boxed聽HW Labs BlackIce SR-1 420 radiator聽that will be waiting patiently for MiniMe to grow up and get hooked on WCing聽馃槑

So to the point: I am about to move in into new house i have build over the last 2 years in Poland. It has floor heating on its 230m2 and has one peculiar extra loop - 35m of a floor heating tube with an inlet and outlet under the to-be-build-desk where my PC in my man-cave will be placed聽馃槑聽you know where am i going with this?聽

1) heat capacity of concrete floor is quite high (thickness in my case varies from 6 to 9cm)聽and at the same time inertia of heat flow is rather low. In other words: it will heat up slowly and will cool down slowly.

2) floor will never be heated above 28掳C so i can assume聽that's gonna be my max ambient temperature. It is more likely, considering my house is very energy efficient, floor temperature will not pass 25掳C. Cooling liquid will always be warmer than that and there will be no situation when loop is being heated by the floor - it will be always other way around.

So for those who don't know about floor heating it is done like that (perspective of this pic is really distorted as windows on left and right are perpendicular to each other):

FmBGhH_X8FG8VMUvtEcD0LBvvtpBYeM_-txw0Pak

And the additional loop i have placed in a very last literally hour before聽the floor was poured. And as of now the loop ends look similar like on the pic below (man-cave is already tiled and the walls are finished with plaster and painting):

qCCU3RvIZGaSdSNZMv2flzLkNCPA0sWoUPQGbOk5

As you can see i know exactly what聽i am doing with this. What i need is some advice on WC gear as i have stopped following the market / trends many years ago (family, work, lack of time for gaming etc.the usual story...):

- circulation pump: i doubt regular WC pump will be able to handle such hydraulic resistance (tube has ID=12mm and 35m length). So i will be getting a pump used typically in heating systems. Is it the right route? You have other suggestions?聽

- i need to figure out quick-disconnects and want to build some sort of a manifold to be able to quickly attach / detach PC without bleeding air into the loop. Preferably at the desk's top close to the PC case. If the loop is not efficient enough i want to be able to quickly add radiators at my will. Any advice how to approach this aspect of a system?聽

- what sort of reservoir聽do i need? The volume of liquid in a tube alone gonna be pi*r^2*L = 3.1415*0.006m^2*35m = ca 4L, so really little. But considerably a lot in terms of WC systems (BIG tube reservoir for PC is 0.4L).

- since i will not be needing (if it all works at the end...聽馃ぃ) radiators i will be on the market for a small case. Not planning on changing my PC dramatically, so ATX MB size, fairly long GPU and at least 2x HDD and few SSD must fit in that case. If it has bulk-head type pass through at the back to run the tubes, that would save me time on modding the case.聽

ALL ON BOARD THE CHOO-CHOO TRAIN!

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Posted Original PosterOP

That's why I want to have an option for connecting the rad ready and waiting at my desk. You know what crossed my mind as much cheaper option compared to x2 D5s? Aquarium pump similar to one I use in my sump. It has 2m+ head pressure, can be run submerged if needed - I can use a bucket as a reservoir and since it will be an open system (evaporation must be under control) the pressure on WCing components won't be an issue.

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4 hours ago, g g d h said:

-SNIP-

You will need a pump that is capable of moving that volume of water fairly well, due to the tube there won't be high restriction but high frictional loss from the fluid itself moving through the tubing.聽

I'd recommend something pretty beefy like the ones Linus used in his whole room cooling loop or something like this below. For the loop it may be best to have a dual loop one portion under the pad and one that is only to the PC with a heat exhanger that way the fluids never mix and issues arising in the PC do not affect the quality of the loop that is unreachable in the concrete.聽

https://koolance.com/pump-g-1-4-bsp-pmp-600

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Posted Original PosterOP

11m head pressure? A circulation pump in a heat pump i use as heat source for my house has 4.8m @ ca 16L/min and runs 1750m of tubing in 26 loops. Who this Koolance pump is actually for? Hard to imagine a cooling system optimal for this pump...

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1 minute ago, g g d h said:

11m head pressure? A circulation pump in a heat pump i use as heat source for my house has 4.8m @ ca 16L/min and runs 1750m of tubing in 26 loops. Who this Koolance pump is actually for? Hard to imagine a cooling system optimal for this pump...

I've seen a few builds where they've done the whole room watercooling type idea but to locate the rads from the PC down into the basement of their house going though the floor and having two of theses in series to provide enough pressure for the whole loop up to the PC through all the blocks and back down. Note that pressure is directly proportional to flow so at 11m you essentially have zero flow which mean no actual cooling. This pump would only have 3M of head pressure at approx 16LPM of flow to comparing to your heat pump, if that is not just the absolute max ratings.

pmp-xxx_g1.gif

For the heatpump it doesn't require a lot of pressure being that yours has 26 parallel loops providing very little restriction. In a PC once you start adding blocks and long tubing runs at a decent height that's not just on a single plane like in a slab it can add up.

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Posted Original PosterOP

I have doubts a PC cooling system is more restrictive them 1.75km of tubing with hundreds of 90掳 turns and tens of 180掳 turns. Half of that length is at the upper floor, so it is not a single plane.

And 3x manifolds with 26 rotameters with cut-off valves...聽

I still think these Koolance pumps are just ridiculous.

;)

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On 6/11/2019 at 4:22 PM, g g d h said:

-SNIP-

As said it depends on the application and type of pump that one is聽just a heavy duty D5 design, with 26 parallel loops of 1.75km you still have very little restrictions since there are lots of paths to take. The most restrictive section of a loop will be blocks, for a regular a PC it will be cycling the entire volume of the loop around every 5-10 seconds. The in floor heating doesn't require that kind of flow or pressure for it's application.聽

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Posted Original PosterOP

You are right.聽

But I can bet I can go away with low flow because of the volume of liquid in the loop. 35m of tubing will hold ca. 4L on its own. Hardly any WC system gets anywhere near it.聽

I will experiment with the pumps I have. In my pc I have this pump known for being modded with solder mod to boost its performance - that was long time ago, will have to refresh my memory. Also have two aquarium pumps to test (planning on getting bigger one for a fish tank anyways).

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3 hours ago, g g d h said:

You are right.聽

But I can bet I can go away with low flow because of the volume of liquid in the loop. 35m of tubing will hold ca. 4L on its own. Hardly any WC system gets anywhere near it.聽

I will experiment with the pumps I have. In my pc I have this pump known for being modded with solder mod to boost its performance - that was long time ago, will have to refresh my memory. Also have two aquarium pumps to test (planning on getting bigger one for a fish tank anyways).

Wouldn't be a bad idea to do a simple test by hooking up the tubing loop with the pumps and a bucket to check the flow and what is needed. I'd also help to flush the loop if there is any dust or debris in it from construction.聽

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