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TheBritishVillain

What EXACTLY did Huawei do?

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2 minutes ago, SydneySideSteveSomewheres said:

Right-o then as you were, apologies for the interruption...

its fine, i just despice those sort of walls. 

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2 minutes ago, Settlerteo said:

What they did is that they are making a lot of money and US is falling back behind China in terms of economy and that by a very large margin. It has nothing to do with spying. Everybody's spying.

Cultural differences have come to the foreground, the morality, and from that, the policy differences between two competing national ideals have become the discord between the two nations.


Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves (Abraham Lincoln,1808-1865; 16th US president).

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2 minutes ago, SydneySideSteveSomewheres said:

Cultural differences have come to the foreground, the morality, and from that, the policy differences between two competing national ideals have become the discord between the two nations.

it has nothing to do with cultures my friend. Nor nations nor ideals. It's just about money and power. It would be the same with any other country from anywhere in the world if they were in the position of China.

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On 5/24/2019 at 7:26 PM, Settlerteo said:

it has nothing to do with cultures my friend. Nor nations nor ideals. It's just about money and power. It would be the same with any other country from anywhere in the world if they were in the position of China.

Governments (even the Chinese) promote capitalism for the good of the nation. Trump especially (Regan too) was elected to bring about law changes that would favour businesses, particularly American interests, that would enable them to make more profit.

In trickle-down economics, if businesses are empowered to make money they employ more people and the more people that are employed, benefits the entire nation's cultural identity (it is what is termed, funding the national interest).


Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves (Abraham Lincoln,1808-1865; 16th US president).

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2 hours ago, SydneySideSteveSomewheres said:

-

I get what you're saying but I don't see how that justifies a market ban.


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I love how the US spies on everyone more than anyone else, but they keep pointing their finger at China.

 

But a complete ban is just plain stupid. It would be funny to see China ban some American company, just for jokes.


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" law changes that would favour businesses, particularly American interests, "

yep corporate welfare and some still are basically carking it.

 

" In trickle-down economics, if businesses are empowered to make money they employ more people and the more people that are employed, "

this only works if your not paying slave wages, or should i say wages that dont match the requirements of the workers to actually live and have excess to spend.

 

" benefits the entire nation's cultural identity (it is what is termed, funding the national interest). "

not so sure about this.....

I mean America had a civil war supposedly about slaves, and the declared winner was the union, but they if have changed from having black only slaves to having slaves of every creed (including lower class whites) wouldnt that then mean the confederates actually one.


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Huawei probably could of gotten around the Google problem with their own OS, but the chipsets ban is a severe blow


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13 hours ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

Because those chips are made at TSMC, or Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Company. Taiwan also claims they're "China", much like how in the Koreas, there is no "North Korea" or "South Korea", they both say they're "Korea"

What is to stop china from saying. Hay yeah, we are going to have to have you place bug on these phones your making for X that are being shipped to the US.

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41 minutes ago, Mr. horse said:

What is to stop china from saying. Hay yeah, we are going to have to have you place bug on these phones your making for X that are being shipped to the US.

China has no authority over Taiwanese companies. Taiwan is independent from China. It's like asking if Kim Jong Un can tell Samsung to put backdoors in their hardware

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@SydneySideSteveSomewheres You can't ignore the basic facts of 5G and it's data harvesting side affects. That's the real issue here, and you didn't even touch on it.


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3 hours ago, r2724r16 said:

I love how the US spies on everyone more than anyone else, but they keep pointing their finger at China.

 

But a complete ban is just plain stupid. It would be funny to see China ban some American company, just for jokes.

Uh...that makes no sense. Obviously every company wants to reduce the amount of spying, and keep it at a bare minimum. You do that by not allowing China access to most mobile data in your country (5G towers). It makes perfect sense, if you think about it logically, with risk mitigation in mind.

 

It'd be interesting if China stopped it's heavy metal exports, as they did with Japan. The US's tech giants would grind to a halt awfully fast.


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12 minutes ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

China has no authority over Taiwanese companies. Taiwan is independent from China. It's like asking if Kim Jong Un can tell Samsung to put backdoors in their hardware

I don't think you get what I'm getting at.

Most phones are made in china, the parts might not be but the phones are.

China could tell X plant in china to slip malware or a bug into the phone, not the chips that are being made in say Taiwan or Korea

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34 minutes ago, Mr. horse said:

I don't think you get what I'm getting at.

Most phones are made in china, the parts might not be but the phones are.

China could tell X plant in china to slip malware or a bug into the phone, not the chips that are being made in say Taiwan or Korea

Most manufacturing firms are owned by Taiwanese companies. So the only way for that to actually happen is for a bad agent to slip into them and do it themselves because the company sure as hell isn't going to condone it (unless there's a plot twist)

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20 hours ago, orbitalbuzzsaw said:

Almost all large companies in China have at least some connection to the CCP

All Chinese company's are in some way or form controlled by the goverment


Let's agree to disagree

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27 minutes ago, MrTiC said:

All Chinese company's are in some way or form controlled by the  a goverment

fixed that for you!


I enjoy reading the tech news section until about page 3-4 when it becomes an argument over which company is best.

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43 minutes ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

Most manufacturing firms are owned by Taiwanese companies. So the only way for that to actually happen is for a bad agent to slip into them and do it themselves because the company sure as hell isn't going to condone it (unless there's a plot twist)

I fail to see how the Chinese Gov. can't just walk in and say you have to do X or your out of here. If they can do it with a Chinese company why can't they do it with a Taiwanese plant in china.

 

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6 minutes ago, Mira Yurizaki said:

They could, but then they'd lose out on economic power.

True. But I'm sure they could pull it off and get away with it.

To many company's rely on china for manufacturing and losing their plants in china would be a hard blow to recover form. I'm sure they could get away with pushing around smaller manufacturing company's. But not someone who makes phones for say Samsung.

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12 minutes ago, Mr. horse said:

I fail to see how the Chinese Gov. can't just walk in and say you have to do X or your out of here. If they can do it with a Chinese company why can't they do it with a Taiwanese plant in china.

 

Then they would lose that huge workforce. TSMC for example, would literally pull the plant out, move it back to Taiwan or to India or some other country with similar wages to China.

 

TSMC won't risk those global contracts for companies like AMD and others.


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6 minutes ago, Mr. horse said:

True. But I'm sure they could pull it off and get away with it.

To many company's rely on china for manufacturing and losing their plants in china would be a hard blow to recover form. I'm sure they could get away with pushing around smaller manufacturing company's. But not someone who makes phones for say Samsung.

Those small fry companies usually contract the bigwigs for their manufacturing.

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2 hours ago, dizmo said:

Uh...that makes no sense. Obviously every company wants to reduce the amount of spying, and keep it at a bare minimum. You do that by not allowing China access to most mobile data in your country (5G towers). It makes perfect sense, if you think about it logically, with risk mitigation in mind.

 

It'd be interesting if China stopped it's heavy metal exports, as they did with Japan. The US's tech giants would grind to a halt awfully fast.

And you completely missed my point... which was that the US spies on people just like China does.


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37 minutes ago, r2724r16 said:

And you completely missed my point... which was that the US spies on people just like China does.

Just like everyone else in the world. What you're not getting is that of course the US is going to do all it can to protect itself, and by proxy, those it communicates/deals with on a security level (5 eyes).


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1 hour ago, r2724r16 said:

And you completely missed my point... which was that the US spies on people just like China does.

The difference is when the government makes a request to companies. US companies can refuse a request of the government without the government making it harder to do business within it. Nothing significant, or at least public, came against Apple for refusing the FBI's request to remove the "self destruct" feature of the iPhone if too many wrong guesses were made to unlock it.

 

The allegation is that companies operating in China will comply with government requests, otherwise the government will make sure the company has a hard time doing business in the country.

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12 hours ago, dizmo said:

@SydneySideSteveSomewheres You can't ignore the basic facts of 5G and it's data harvesting side affects. That's the real issue here, and you didn't even touch on it.

Yes, that is correct it would have added another two hundred words, though…lol (I added a link to the Maotai program, aka Google’s Dragonfly project  -link also here- ).

 

The issue of the tracking of an internet user within China is that it is somewhat acceptable for the government to do what we (Westerners) would call an invasion of privacy. Chinese believe that it is the lack of privacy that they have to have. As it provides the national security that their citizenry needs within the current expansion of the middle classes and the sanctuary, they desire for their children’s future security in an expanding nation-state. They believe that they are on the brink of an internal war and the likes of the dystopian retrograde written about in George Orwell’s "Nineteen-eighty-four" (“170 million CCTV cameras across the country” and “China's social credit system…”), will stop the internal dissent and help the resurrection of a Great China.

 

A hypothetical issue of having an outside company (non-US) building what is being touted as the IoT 5G network, could be in how a company without morality could brick pieces of the infrastructure one month after the warranty ends. Causing firstly, a US reseller to need to argue the cause and bear the brunt of the cost of defending it in the US legal system (like Porsche defending VW’s diesel lean burn software). Secondly, the cost of component replacement would make more money for the non-US manufacturer, leaching money from the US economy, devaluing the US national spending power in the global economy (the National Security debate).


Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves (Abraham Lincoln,1808-1865; 16th US president).

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