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LightParticle

Does the youth generations choosing hip-hop over punk-rock?

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Posted · Original PosterOP

About 15-18 years ago I heard a lot of good music rock/punk-rock oriented groups who was playing guitar music with vocal and teenage lyrics about love, searching yourself and other issues what typical teenager come through. So it was about a mainstream music for teenages, there was a lot of bands who been really well known, a lot young artist, singers. It was like a teenager outlet music, they was sharing their thought and playing in a dad's house garage. Leaders in that type of music was bands like Sum41 or Linkin Park.

 

But today after a one or two generations, hip-hop is became a teenage mecca, so the lyrics changed, the issues changes. They starting to talk about not girls but pimp-game, not a life/career but money-money-money who is hot who is cool and what not.

 

But I'm not american, I'm just like everyone else is looking for american culture and tendencies what america is bring to the world. And how you think, do they really teenagers started to choose more hip-hop kind of outlet for their issues, psychology and life over the old-fashion punk/punk-rock mentality which is really think about life in a global scale, more depth in lyrical way and wider range of poetics. Is that really happenning or I'm wrong?

 

And do you think about this kind of global tendency changed in the minds of younger generation. Is that bood? Is that good? And what do they think about yourself and how they are express themselfs today through acessable art methods, like music, thoughts and so on?

 

 

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Firstly, Linkin Park has about as much to do with punk as Dolly Parton has with 2 tone ska.

 

Secondly, you're looking at this through very rose colored glasses. Try to actually go back and listen to pop-punk bands of the 00's. Most of them didn't talk about getting a career or about life in a global perspective. They sang simplistic songs about being a snotty brat and about how grown-ups sucked.

You can think of the music as you will, but the lyrics of these bands were absolutely lowest common denominator.

 

Thirdly, these modern rappers are just the latest iteration of a trend that's as old as pop music. The trend of hedonism. What a Lil' Pump brings to the table today is no different than what Poison brought back in the 80's.


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It does appear that Hip Hop is the cool thing to be into today. I honestly am not interested in it at all. I just don’t like that style of music or the culture that goes with it. 

 

However being born in the 80’s and growing up in the 90’s-00’s I listen to very different and more varied styles of music. 

 

The whole hip hop, urban, street culture thing could not be any further from what I grew up around. 

 

 

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Hip-hop always was and always will be more mainstream than metal, punk, or rock.

 

Even at the heyday of Linkin Park popularity, it was nowhere near as popular as Eminem, 50 Cent, or other mainstream rappers/hip-hoppers. 

 

So yeah, you're just wearing rose-colored glasses. 


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Posted · Original PosterOP

So, What do you think about young boys who are "spitting" in the mic about money and "hoes" instead of playing guitar in garage about things like love and passion?

 

Where is the end point of this music and type of mentality for a hip-hop generation? I mean, you can be like hard and wealthy commiting crimes how gangsta rap recommends you do, but what next? I mean, ok, you had nothing and now you have pocket full of hundreds, but how about your soul, how about things what you love, how about things which others love. I mean we have to surpass our "housewives" mentality to something more special, to open up a new world for us for young men and woman, but instead of that we care about things which are just come and go without any purpose.

 

Is it degradation of our world vision? For mainstream reality mean. You can sit and think let them do whatever they want, but anyway, isn't that bad? 

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I don't think you can just blanket call the "youth" and say they all listen to the same music. I have yet to meet anyone with the same exact music taste. I'd be more inclined to say rap is more popular than pop


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Just keeping this here as a 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I do listen to rap, but that being said I don't listen to the crap that Spotify picks out that's "hot" or what's on the charts. My music taste is... surprisingly old.

Everyone listens to something different, be it 70s rock, 90s R&B or even doo-wop.


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Love me some old school hip hop. But I also love metal and alternative and trance and bass music and shoegaze and jazz and elevator music (to name a few genres) so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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i pretty much MAINLY focus on R&B and hip hop, though i dabble in a bit of other genres too (except country because fuck your yeehaw shit). Lately tho i've been kinda listening to more and more heavy metal which is peculiar.


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You are overanalizing something and oversimplifiying it at the same time.

Different people have different music preferences. Some listen to rock, some to rap etc. It isn't bound by their age.

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Posted · Original PosterOP
10 minutes ago, Origami Cactus said:

You are overanalizing something and oversimplifiying it at the same time.

Different people have different music preferences. Some listen to rock, some to rap etc. It isn't bound by their age.

Yeah, right. But you are little overconcrete what I was trying to say. I meant ours (generally, people) or mainstream taste of music and type of peotry which spinning aroud the basic insticts and have a lack of subjects, what is defining people or just us as not very discerning taste folk which all of this is leading us to like a nowhere.

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15 hours ago, LightParticle said:

So, What do you think about young boys who are "spitting" in the mic about money and "hoes" instead of playing guitar in garage about things like love and passion?

 

Where is the end point of this music and type of mentality for a hip-hop generation? I mean, you can be like hard and wealthy commiting crimes how gangsta rap recommends you do, but what next? I mean, ok, you had nothing and now you have pocket full of hundreds, but how about your soul, how about things what you love, how about things which others love. I mean we have to surpass our "housewives" mentality to something more special, to open up a new world for us for young men and woman, but instead of that we care about things which are just come and go without any purpose.

 

Is it degradation of our world vision? For mainstream reality mean. You can sit and think let them do whatever they want, but anyway, isn't that bad? 

I think young boys rapping about cash, money, hoes and lean are saying what's on their mind. 

Just like what Good Charlotte did when they sang about girls universally being materialistic, or Sum 41 did when they sang about being a Nth degree slacker that wasn't gonna conform to your society, man.

 

What's the end goal? Probably the same as most pop-punk, rock and pop.

The goal is to be an easily digestible product that can be churned out fast and swallowed by the public that identifies with the music. 

Pop music has always been vapid, materialistic and concerned with the now. It's made, marketed and distributed to young people, who are also often vapid, materialistic and concerned with the now. 

 

You seem to be under the misconception that just becuase you find meaning in a piece of work then it's obkectivly better and more meaningful than something you don't like. 

 

On a larger scale there's really nothing to worry about. I have yet to see the research that indicates that people will mindlessly copy what happens in the media they consume.

No kid is out there, listening to Takashi69, and thinking: "I really should get into racketeering". 

 

On 4/16/2019 at 1:20 AM, Giganthrax said:

Hip-hop always was and always will be more mainstream than metal, punk, or rock.

 

Even at the heyday of Linkin Park popularity, it was nowhere near as popular as Eminem, 50 Cent, or other mainstream rappers/hip-hoppers. 

 

So yeah, you're just wearing rose-colored glasses. 

That's a truth with a serious footnote.

Hip-hop didn't really enter into the popular consciousness untill at least a decade after it's inception and it wasn't untill 2017 that hip-hop & R&B overtook rock as the most popular genre in the US.


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Posted · Original PosterOP

Yes, you're right, there is nothing to serious worry about. But I'm just think about this media stream rocking numbers of probably a dumb shit is overshadows the wider vision of reality.

You know, things like Truth, your inner-self, and higher vision of realm what we are experiencing and a lot other meaningful stuff which is dealing with on daily basis.

I think It's just blocks our like neuro-signals system and programming our feeling and belief system through all of that.

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3 hours ago, LightParticle said:

Yes, you're right, there is nothing to serious worry about. But I'm just think about this media stream rocking numbers of probably a dumb shit is overshadows the wider vision of reality.

You know, things like Truth, your inner-self, and higher vision of realm what we are experiencing and a lot other meaningful stuff which is dealing with on daily basis.

I think It's just blocks our like neuro-signals system and programming our feeling and belief system through all of that.

Wait, how are you both agreeing and disagreeing with at the same time?

I'm not trying to be a dick here, but you're saying two contradictory things here.

 

If you think listening to trash music will lead to a neurological change in the subject, then you would need evidence to support that claim. Before such evidence is presented it's an empty claim.

 

You also seem to change your thesis as you go along. You started this out with it being about punk rock and now it's about Truth in some sort of spiritual manner.

The reason why such music isn't popular is because it's pretty far outside of the largest overlap of the pop-cultural Venn diagram.

As a general rule people like to be entertained by their entertainment. Contemplating the nature and implications of nihilism with Mgła might be "deep", but it's hardly fun.

This is, of course, not to say that people don't enjoy music with a meaning nor that meaningful music can't chart.


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Posted · Original PosterOP
33 minutes ago, Volbet said:

If you think listening to trash music will lead to a neurological change in the subject, then you would need evidence to support that claim. Before such evidence is presented it's an empty claim.

Yes, Unfortunately I'm not a neurologist neither psychlogist, but I think it is happening, we just did notice it because this kind of stuff affect our subconsicousness I suppose, and our collective subconsciousness, so it's hard to really notice any difference after listening one song. 

 

But I think we just in position of lack research in this important area, or maybe I did not find one.

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5 hours ago, handymanshandle said:

I do listen to rap, but that being said I don't listen to the crap that Spotify picks out that's "hot" or what's on the charts. My music taste is... surprisingly old.

Everyone listens to something different, be it 70s rock, 90s R&B or even doo-wop.

Billie Eilish is my jam atm

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10 hours ago, LightParticle said:

Yes, Unfortunately I'm not a neurologist neither psychlogist, but I think it is happening, we just did notice it because this kind of stuff affect our subconsicousness I suppose, and our collective subconsciousness, so it's hard to really notice any difference after listening one song. 

 

But I think we just in position of lack research in this important area, or maybe I did not find one.

But why would we assume that music is different from movies and video games

Both of those media have been studied ad infinitum and no link has been found between the consumption of violent media and the expression of aggressive behavior in real life. 

 

The main studies I've been able to find on music have been rather ambiguous in terms of their conclusions. Some find that certain types of violent imagery increases aggression in the subject, but never concludes that this aggression can take an external form. 

 


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Posted · Original PosterOP

No-no-no, I meant not agression. The type of research what you posted is about worrying about older generations 60-70's was afraid of virtual world, music and stuff what the did not understand. But I'm talking about not a movie/music/games rating, explicit content and violent. I'm talking about how this mainstream media is programming us neurological way, it's take more indepnth reserach in neurscience and deep psychology and psychoanalysis. Not parents worrying about why his child playing FPS games

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On 4/15/2019 at 9:33 PM, Volbet said:

Firstly, Linkin Park has about as much to do with punk as Dolly Parton has with 2 tone ska.

 

Secondly, you're looking at this through very rose colored glasses. Try to actually go back and listen to pop-punk bands of the 00's. Most of them didn't talk about getting a career or about life in a global perspective. They sang simplistic songs about being a snotty brat and about how grown-ups sucked.

You can think of the music as you will, but the lyrics of these bands were absolutely lowest common denominator.

 

Thirdly, these modern rappers are just the latest iteration of a trend that's as old as pop music. The trend of hedonism. What a Lil' Pump brings to the table today is no different than what Poison brought back in the 80's.

Yeah... and people sometimes forget Queen made a song entirely about "fat bottomed girls". And one about sexual attraction to a car. It doesn't matter how far back you go (as long as you're talking about pop songs), some bands were about the melody and some about the lyrics, a rare few about both - and those that were about neither were forgotten.

23 minutes ago, LightParticle said:

No-no-no, I didn't mean aggression. The type of research you posted is about older generations from the 60-70's who were afraid of the virtual world, music and stuff they did not understand. But I'm not talking about a movie/music/games rating, explicit content and violence. I'm talking about how this mainstream media is programming us in a neurological way, it takes more in depth research in neuroscience, deep psychology and psychoanalysis.

I don't know, based on your few comments it seems to me you don't understand modern music. Or music as a whole. I'm not a fan of hip-hop but that's just my personal taste and I don't go around saying it's an inferior form of expression or scaremongering about the lyrics - which doesn't mean they shouldn't be criticized when they're terrible or offensive of course. Every genre and every time period has bad music - it only seems to get worse with time because people tend to forget the bad songs from their childhood and teenage years.


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-Lenovo Thinkpad X220 - [8/10]

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A durable and reliable machine that is relatively lightweight, has all the hardware it needs to never feel sluggish and has a great IPS matte screen. Downsides are mostly due to its age, most notably the screen resolution of 1366x768 and usb 2.0 ports.

 

-Apple Macbook (2015) - [Garbage -/10]

Spoiler

From my perspective, this product has no redeeming factors given its price and the competition. It is underpowered, overpriced, impractical due to its single port and is made redundant even by Apple's own iPad pro line.

 

-OnePlus X - [7/10]

Spoiler

A good phone for the price. It does everything I (and most people) need without being sluggish and has no particularly bad flaws. The lack of recent software updates and relatively barebones feature kit (most notably the lack of 5GHz wifi, biometric sensors and backlight for the capacitive buttons) prevent it from being exceptional.

 

-Microsoft Surface Book 2 - [Garbage - -/10]

Spoiler

Overpriced and rushed, offers nothing notable compared to the competition, doesn't come with an adequate charger despite the premium price. Worse than the Macbook for not even offering the small plus sides of having macOS. Buy a Razer Blade if you want high performance in a (relatively) light package.

 

-Intel Core i7 2600/k - [9/10]

Spoiler

Quite possibly Intel's best product launch ever. It had all the bleeding edge features of the time, it came with a very significant performance improvement over its predecessor and it had a soldered heatspreader, allowing for efficient cooling and great overclocking. Even the "locked" version could be overclocked through the multiplier within (quite reasonable) limits.

 

-Apple iPad Pro - [5/10]

Spoiler

A pretty good product, sunk by its price (plus the extra cost of the physical keyboard and the pencil). Buy it if you don't mind the Apple tax and are looking for a very light office machine with an excellent digitizer. Particularly good for rich students. Bad for cheap tinkerers like myself.

 

 

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4 hours ago, LightParticle said:

No-no-no, I meant not agression. The type of research what you posted is about worrying about older generations 60-70's was afraid of virtual world, music and stuff what the did not understand. But I'm talking about not a movie/music/games rating, explicit content and violent. I'm talking about how this mainstream media is programming us neurological way, it's take more indepnth reserach in neurscience and deep psychology and psychoanalysis. Not parents worrying about why his child playing FPS games

That makes no sense.

If a neurological change was to occur it would have to have to manifest outwardly in some fashion. Else it would be phenomenologically meaningless to assume.

 

What the various studies on media and violence shows, in a grander picture, is that there's no correlation between the content of media and what the subjects outwardly express. Or said in a different way, if there is a neurological change that occurs it doesn't manifest externally. It's therefor null to speculate on such matters. At least at this point.

 

4 hours ago, Sauron said:

Yeah... and people sometimes forget Queen made a song entirely about "fat bottomed girls". And one about sexual attraction to a car. It doesn't matter how far back you go (as long as you're talking about pop songs), some bands were about the melody and some about the lyrics, a rare few about both - and those that were about neither were forgotten

Are you trying to tell me that I Like Bananas Because They Have No Bones wasn't the hight of intellectual discourse in music?


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Give me The Lillingtons or Groovie Ghoulies over anything "hip hop" these days.

Both the pop punk bands I just mentioned had a more positive lyrical attitude and better overall songs than LP ever did.

 

Of course, then there is metal, in all its wonderful forms who write everything from 80s Poison-style bubble-gum lyrics, to ultra-deep historical stuff from bands like Siebenburgen and Marduk.

 


So rise up, all ye lost ones, as one, we'll claw the clouds

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On 4/16/2019 at 10:28 AM, LightParticle said:

So, What do you think about young boys who are "spitting" in the mic about money and "hoes" instead of playing guitar in garage about things like love and passion?

 

Where is the end point of this music and type of mentality for a hip-hop generation? I mean, you can be like hard and wealthy commiting crimes how gangsta rap recommends you do, but what next? I mean, ok, you had nothing and now you have pocket full of hundreds, but how about your soul, how about things what you love, how about things which others love. I mean we have to surpass our "housewives" mentality to something more special, to open up a new world for us for young men and woman, but instead of that we care about things which are just come and go without any purpose.

 

Is it degradation of our world vision? For mainstream reality mean. You can sit and think let them do whatever they want, but anyway, isn't that bad? 

First of all, every generation before ours said the exact same things about new genres. Rock N Roll, Elvis was criticized and called "Pelvis" for the way he jived along to music. Nirvana was called a passing fad with gross, hedonistic values along with the rest of grunge. Yet, look at how bands like Nirvana and Soundgarden shaped the music world.

 

Second of all not all hip-hop/rap songs are like the way you described. I think you forget how many punk rock bands promote the "fuck the society, fuck the system, fuck the rules" mentality, along with the promotion of suicidal tendencies. I have nothing wrong with punk, grunge etc. I like almost every song I've heard. Nas, Kendrick Lamar, J. Cole, Mf DOOM, etc. have all promoted positive messages of empowerment, racially, culturally, anti drug messages, anti gang etc.  


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Posted · Original PosterOP
15 minutes ago, CharminUltraStrong said:

First of all, every generation before ours said the exact same things about new genres. Rock N Roll, Elvis was criticized and called "Pelvis" for the way he jived along to music. Nirvana was called a passing fad with gross, hedonistic values along with the rest of grunge. Yet, look at how bands like Nirvana and Soundgarden shaped the music world.

 

Second of all not all hip-hop/rap songs are like the way you described. I think you forget how many punk rock bands promote the "fuck the society, fuck the system, fuck the rules" mentality, along with the promotion of suicidal tendencies. I have nothing wrong with punk, grunge etc. I like almost every song I've heard. Nas, Kendrick Lamar, J. Cole, Mf DOOM, etc. have all promoted positive messages of empowerment, racially, culturally, anti drug messages, anti gang etc.  

 

Yes, I agree with you about empowerment, it's important this in this hip-hop music tendency and it's very good. But like as everything else this messages are mostly inmature and sounds like youthful maximalism effect. There is no motivation or anything else important in important and smart stuff like college, university, higher education and citizenship rights and anything else similar that way.

 

So they just "pumping" raw energy (in bad terms) without any conclusion, really meaningful thoughts etc about growth, maturity higher vision and perception of reality. The "empower message" what they are providing is a little bit a "liner": have this? let's got more. "Get the strap" like of advices.

 

I like this stuff and listen to it, my discontetment about messages what they delivery from '03 to '19. Same s*t goes with every generation, even with older ones. So no progression in this area, actually.

 

P/S

Please, don't get me wrong, I do not argue with you and don't blame the music and I don't statement about stupidity, maybe I wrong at some point. I'm just curious about this subject I'm just interesting to accelerate discussion for this topic for any view and thoughts what you have.

 

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Sum 41 is a lot more punk than Linkin Park will probably ever be.

 

I honestly don't know why most of the popular music these days is popular, I personally can't stand a lot of hip hop.

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On 4/16/2019 at 10:28 AM, LightParticle said:

So, What do you think about young boys who are "spitting" in the mic about money and "hoes" instead of playing guitar in garage about things like love and passion?

 

Where is the end point of this music and type of mentality for a hip-hop generation? I mean, you can be like hard and wealthy commiting crimes how gangsta rap recommends you do, but what next? I mean, ok, you had nothing and now you have pocket full of hundreds, but how about your soul, how about things what you love, how about things which others love. I mean we have to surpass our "housewives" mentality to something more special, to open up a new world for us for young men and woman, but instead of that we care about things which are just come and go without any purpose.

 

Is it degradation of our world vision? For mainstream reality mean. You can sit and think let them do whatever they want, but anyway, isn't that bad? 

I mean that's not the point of punk.  Punk is an anti-conformist movement with anti-government/system/establishment views. 

3 minutes ago, Crunchy Dragon said:

Sum 41 is a lot more punk than Linkin Park will probably ever be.

 

I honestly don't know why most of the popular music these days is popular, I personally can't stand a lot of hip hop.

They were more bubblegum punk, though aka pop punk.  This is punk rock...
 

 


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