Microsoft Should be VERY Afraid of Linux Gaming

[mach]

14 minutes ago, cryosis_ said:

 

Please don't get me wrong I just wanted to share my view and experience, on how a long time windows users like myself feel and think when they first attempt the switch. 

I understand there are different apps for a different OS. 

I've tried mac OS, ubuntu, mint, centos.

They're all new to me but when compared with mac os, the linux distros required me a lot more googling for fairly basic tasks. 

I really want to make the permanent switch on my main PC as I despise microsoft. But I'm not sure if I'm ready for the headache because I'm sure there will be some incompatibilities and problems.

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

4 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

I can take a program meant for a consumer version of Windows (such as Steam), and run it on Enterprise, LTSB, etc. The differences boil down to feature lockouts, but that’s a tier system that still doesn’t affect what I can do within Windows.

 

Whereas programs made for Ubuntu will not run in Kali and might not run in distros like Arch, Debian, etc.

that's because all those versions of Windows are still Windows 10 at the core. but you cannot run that program on an older version of Windows. 

 

besides if you compile the program on linux it's irrelevant what distro you use. Snap is helping a lot with that too. if you wanna install spotify for example it doesn't matter if you have Arch, Ubuntu, Fedora etc, as long as snap is installed all you do is snap install spotify in terminal or look for it in the package manager. 

[Drak3]

Just now, firelighter487 said:

besides if you compile the program on linux it's irrelevant what distro you use.

No, it’s not. Some distros are not cross compatible. Anything based on Backtrack/Kali does not work with anything Debian based (installing both on the same drive usually ends with Kali killing the Debian based distro). Android cannot run Linux programs without modification.

 

3 minutes ago, firelighter487 said:

Snap is helping a lot with that too. if you wanna install spotify for example it doesn't matter if you have Arch, Ubuntu, Fedora etc, as long as snap is installed all you do is snap install spotify in terminal or look for it in the package manager. 

That sounds like a package manager that just detects your OS and installs the version compatible with your OS.

[mach]

1 minute ago, firelighter487 said:

@mach sure, learning Linux involves a lot of googling. but that's with anything. if i told you to edit a regstry value in Windows to fix a problem you'd have to google that too. 

 

a lot of pages for apps are clearly laid out with commands already made for you that you can copy-paste. 

 

now with Proton everything is done for you. there are games that require additional stuff but that is documented well and will be among the top results if you google it. 

 

getting away from Windows and learning a whole new OS can be tough at first but it's worth it  

 

besides this goes for macOS too. i use that as a daily OS and at first i had to google how to do stuff too. but once you learn it gets much easier. 

I've had bad experience with linux before. 

For example I couldn't get youtube to play, I couldn't get nvidia driver installed properly so the gpu won't idle etc..

For each of them I spent a couple of hours with dozens of tutorials opened, followed line by line but still couldn't solve it at the end.

Perhaps things are more polished now. Maybe the day most games I play are natively supported on linux I'll make the switch on my main PC.

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

Just now, Drak3 said:

That sounds like a package manager that just detects your OS and installs the version compatible with your OS.

it's not. it's all the same. google what snap is and how it works because you clearly don't know. 

 

research first before arguing please. 

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

Just now, mach said:

I've had bad experience with linux before. 

For example I couldn't get youtube to play, I couldn't get nvidia driver installed properly so the gpu won't idle etc..

For each of them I spent a couple of hours with dozens of tutorials opened, followed line by line but still couldn't solve it at the end.

Perhaps things are more polished now. Maybe the day most games I play are natively supported on linux I'll make the switch on my main PC.

when was this? a few years ago it was pretty bad but now this doesn't happen often. it still happens on some distro's but i would never recommend those to someone just starting with linux. 

[Drak3]

1 minute ago, firelighter487 said:

it's all the same.

No, it’s not. Hence different installers that are not cross compatible. Hence dedicated versions for drivers and programs for different distro trees.

[mach]

7 minutes ago, firelighter487 said:

when was this? a few years ago it was pretty bad but now this doesn't happen often. it still happens on some distro's but i would never recommend those to someone just starting with linux. 

2-3 years ago on mint if I recall correctly. 

I also had a fresh install of stock centos that would soft brick on login screen. 

At the moment I have the latest ubuntu on one of my laptops but touch screen is still a bit janky. 

[Chunchunmaru_]

21 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

I can take a program meant for a consumer version of Windows (such as Steam), and run it on Enterprise, LTSB, etc. The differences boil down to feature lockouts, but that’s a tier system that still doesn’t affect what I can do within Windows.

 

Whereas programs made for Ubuntu will not run in Kali and might not run in distros like Arch, Debian, etc.

That's why I said it's up to the developer, Valve may have interest in only support ubuntu for some reason (like they sold the steam machines) but in that case its just a developer fault not supporting every architecture by creating a .snap or .flatpak and has nothing to do with the OS capabilities

That's when the community comes in, and created snap and flatpaks by themselves, or even arch packages (in manjaro is preinstalled)

Btw steam for linux is actually a launcher, the actual steam gets downloaded in your home folder and has it's own libraries (I'm just saying you can copy-paste the folders from a system to another)

[Murasaki]

At 7:36, which desktop environment flavor is this?

[Chunchunmaru_]

10 minutes ago, Mayushii said:

At 7:36, which desktop environment flavor is this?

KDE Plasma 5, with the Manjaro Linux theme

[Drak3]

19 minutes ago, Chunchunmaru_ said:

That's why I said it's up to the developer, Valve may have interest in only support ubuntu for some reason (like they sold the steam machines) but in that case its just a developer fault not supporting every architecture by creating a .snap or .flatpak and has nothing to do with the OS capabilities

You seem to be missing the point.

 

Linux is arbitrarily fragmented for the sake of being arbitrarily fragmented.

[Chunchunmaru_]

10 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

You seem to be missing the point.

Linux is arbitrarily fragmented for the sake of being arbitrarily fragmented.

But it is not a linux issue at all, it's just some people doing this for some unknown reason, like eclipse does the same on windows (Would you say it's windows fault for this?) and sometimes ships a folder with the program on it without even a setup for example (does that even for linux but here you can use the repository)

And honestly it's more a thing from the past, you seem to be stuck 10 years ago

Since the example you made is a very common program, it's already ported by the community to make it work on other distros

Edited April 10, 2019 by Chunchunmaru_

[Drak3]

5 minutes ago, Chunchunmaru_ said:

But it is not a linux issue at all

Yes, it is. Linux devs are arbitrarily fragmenting the OS family with no valid reason for doing so.

[Chunchunmaru_]

25 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Yes, it is. Linux devs are arbitrarily fragmenting the OS family with no valid reason for doing so.

Linux devs? What do you mean? It's Valve in this case, just a guess but I think when they started releasing steam for linux (only for ubuntu) the people at the arch community already ported the package, so that was no really valid reason for valve to port it to other distributions

If a developer wants to make sure it's program works everywhere, it just ships you the binary with the library,  has a 0 cost but just looks as shit like when you do that for windows

Edited April 10, 2019 by Chunchunmaru_

[Drak3]

8 minutes ago, Chunchunmaru_ said:

Linux devs? What do you mean?

Canonical.

Kali.

Red Hat.

Etc.

16 minutes ago, Chunchunmaru_ said:

It's Valve in this case,

Program devs can not be reasonably expected to create programs for subsets of a microscopic market if they don't stand to make a profit off of it.

[bradwiggo]

18 hours ago, floofer said:

I wouldn’t say afraid. Windows is still a lot more appealing, not to mention already pre-installed. 87% of the market is still pretty high. I don’t see that changing any time soon.

For gaming, I see little advantage to windows. One could argue price is an advantage, but you can just run Windows for free. 

[Chunchunmaru_]

2 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Canonical.

Kali.

Red Hat.

Etc.

 

Those are distro maintaners and also companies, how could that be their responsibility exactly?

 

3 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Program devs can not be reasonably expected to create programs for subsets of a microscopic market if they don't stand to make a profit off of it.

 

And what are you talking about now?
I don't understand honestly. Are we talking about developers not shipping their software correctly by purpose, or shipping software at all? It's not just speaking about a microscopic market or not.

[Drak3]

1 minute ago, Chunchunmaru_ said:

Those are distro maintaners and also companies, how could that be their responsibility exactly?

Those are the primary developers of Ubuntu, Kali Linux, and RHEL.

 

1 minute ago, Chunchunmaru_ said:

And what are you talking about now?

The same fucking thing I've been talking about.

 

LINUX is arbitrarily fragmented. Many LINUX distros break cross compatibility. It is a uniquely LINUX issue.

[Chunchunmaru_]

15 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

Those are the primary developers of Ubuntu, Kali Linux, and RHEL.

 

The same fucking thing I've been talking about

1) Those are not necessarily developers, check what a Linux distribution is, Canonical does not develop Ubuntu, they just put together software, offer web storage and bandwidth, which depends if you call it "developing" or not since it's also based on Debian with it's base (They developed the basic tools for shipping the distribution, debian community are all volunteers anyway)
Canonical employees only actually develop a bunch of applications (mostly regarding the cloud if I don't remember wrong, and projects like Mir), the Ubuntu community has volunteers where can or cannot be hired by canonical, like maintainers who actually update software and manage things, but they do not develop anything, they just may be testing updates and porting piece of patches/software updates from the actual projects releases like GNOME.

2) You seemed to changed the subject from "Linux is fragmented" to "Developers do not care about shipping software in a small OS" which obviously have nothing to do with doing that incorrectly, it's not easier or harder to do that.

3) Watch your profanity please I'm not acting mean to you, please

 

15 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

LINUX is arbitrarily fragmented. Many LINUX distros break cross compatibility. It is a uniquely LINUX issue.

It's not, it's not that even hard to ship software correctly, and a perfect example is Davinci Resolve who went from shipping .debs to .appimage, which exactly behave like Windows and do not have any pre-requirements as it's a plain and simple setup binary



Linux is not special like Windows even isn't in this case, they do not work that differently speaking of opening software

Edited April 10, 2019 by Chunchunmaru_

[TorturdChaos]

I have been using Ubuntu for my daily driver for the past 5 years.  For the first 3 years I dual booted Win10, and would occasionally log over to Windows to play windows only games.  But the last 2 years or so, I have rarely felt the need to log over.  Between SteamPlay, Proton, and Lutris 90% of the games I want to play are either natively supported, or easily ran through a compatibly layer.

 

About 6 months ago I removed my windows install since I hadn't used it in the last year.  I can use Linux for everything I need to do at home.

 

Sadly, I still have to run Windows at work as I can't get Adobe CC to run nicely on Linux.   So Linux can't completely replace Windows for me, but it's getting close.

[Chunchunmaru_]

1 hour ago, TorturdChaos said:

I have been using Ubuntu for my daily driver for the past 5 years.  For the first 3 years I dual booted Win10, and would occasionally log over to Windows to play windows only games.  But the last 2 years or so, I have rarely felt the need to log over.  Between SteamPlay, Proton, and Lutris 90% of the games I want to play are either natively supported, or easily ran through a compatibly layer.

 

About 6 months ago I removed my windows install since I hadn't used it in the last year.  I can use Linux for everything I need to do at home.

 

Sadly, I still have to run Windows at work as I can't get Adobe CC to run nicely on Linux.   So Linux can't completely replace Windows for me, but it's getting close.

I don't think adobe is releasing it's suite for Linux anytime soon, unless Wine does some magic and gets decent compatibility with it like it happened with DXVK

[Master Delta Chief]

I've noticed that Manjaro's Xfce desktop environment caused for some graphical issues. The refresh rate kept going down while the fps in-game remained pretty much the same. It happens when the resolution or the refresh rate itself changes. It could be possible that the install of the driver (Nvidia 418 in my case) went wrong or I forgot to do something to finalize the setup. Either way, I installed the KDE Plasma environment, which solved the problem.

[Chunchunmaru_]

7 minutes ago, Master Delta Chief said:

I've noticed that Manjaro's Xfce desktop environment caused for some graphical issues. The refresh rate kept going down while the fps in-game remained pretty much the same. It happens when the resolution or the refresh rate itself changes. It could be possible that the install of the driver (Nvidia 418 in my case) went wrong or I forgot to do something to finalize the setup. Either way, I installed the KDE Plasma environment, which solved the problem.

Xfwm4 sucks on anything else than 60hz, are you using a 144Hz monitor?
Also xfwm doesn't play nice with games, the developer refuses to "bloat" its code for a desktop meant for light PC's
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfwm4/+bug/1087242

[samcool55]

33 minutes ago, Chunchunmaru_ said:

I don't think adobe is releasing it's suite for Linux anytime soon, unless Wine does some magic and gets decent compatibility with it like it happened with DXVK

Well tbh they can't even seem to get it running properly on Ryzen systems that run W10 and with taran's massive buglist i have no hope at all to see adobe CC coming to linux like, at all.

It feels like they are just trying to fight with awful code and should have started from scratch (or from a very basic baseline) years and years ago because when you use the adobe CC i sometimes get the feeling it's fighting with itself when i use it. It's odd but i dunno, that might be just me but i doubt that.