[OLD] PSU Tier List 3.0 (Legacy)

[Ankerson]

1 minute ago, LukeSavenije said:

that's what i mean... I'd change it

 

Exactly, I wouldn't use one today as there are better units available.

[LukeSavenije]

1 minute ago, Ankerson said:

 

Exactly, I wouldn't use one today as there are better units available.

then we're on the same page

[Ankerson]

1 minute ago, LukeSavenije said:

then we're on the same page

 

Yeah something from Tier A or above would be nice.

[LukeSavenije]

Just now, Ankerson said:

 

Yeah something from Tier A or above would be nice.

yeah, tier b sufficient, but a would probably be a good idea for a 2070, as some are dual forward

 

if you want a quiet psu, don't put a 2070 on it

[Ankerson]

1 minute ago, LukeSavenije said:

yeah, tier b sufficient, but a would probably be a good idea for a 2070, as some are dual forward

 

if you want a quiet psu, don't put a 2070 on it

 

That's why I said Tier A or above.

[LukeSavenije]

1 minute ago, Ankerson said:

 

That's why I said Tier A or above.

and i tell you that i have experience with it

 

cxm on a 1070 ti...

[Ankerson]

2 minutes ago, LukeSavenije said:

and i tell you that i have experience with it

 

cxm on a 1070 ti...

 

Yeah.... 

 

I am picky about what PSU's I will buy, very picky.

 

 

[LukeSavenije]

Just now, Ankerson said:

Yeah.... 

 

I am picky about what PSU's I will buy, very picky.

and i just buy what performs good enough

 

and a cxm does

 

i just wasn't aware of double forward problems at that time...

 

but yeah... we're getting derailed

[LogicWeasel]

On 3/18/2019 at 2:20 AM, LienusLateTips said:

Tier A (Mid-Range)  

• Rosewill - Quark, Fortress, Capstone, Lightning, Silent Night, Tachyon, Photon, Capstone G (<=750W)

On 3/18/2019 at 2:20 AM, LienusLateTips said:

Tier B (Budget)

• Rosewill - Capstone G

I presume that is supposed to be a greater-than symbol and not the ' < ' symbol shown for "Capstone G (<=750W)"  So this list is saying that if you see a Capstone G 750 Watt unit or higher, it's a better PSU than a Capstone G 550 Watt?  Perhaps it'd help to include on the Budget tier the designation (<=600W) or something like that, so people get that it's limited to a certain range on both tier groups.

 

 

While I'm bringing up Rosewill, do we have enough data to also rank:

 Glacier, LEPTON, RBR1000, HERCULES, and TOKAMAK models?  (Just by looking at store page for Glacier it seems likely to be crap but the other 4 look promising, albeit the last 2 are quite expensive and high-end; I included hyperlinks to each unit from Newegg, so if it helps you can click on the name if you want to see it's webpage).

 

 

 

I also searched to find out if the RBR1000 has a friendly-name alias (it didn't seem to, despite the name not matching the others), so here's a 2015 review of the unit: https://hexus.net/tech/reviews/psu/87623-rosewill-1000w-bronze/?page=9

 

The page where you can see them all listed for sale: https://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007657 50002177&IsNodeId=1&bop=And&PageSize=96&order=BESTMATCH

[Stefan Payne]

11 hours ago, Ankerson said:

Nothing really wrong with the M12ii 520W

Yes, for example the "mistake" on the label that claims 2 Rails on older Models, from what I could find up to 2017 or even 2018, no UVP on 12V, no OCP, no OTP.

Even Jonnyguru (no tag this time) seems to emphasis more on the importance on OTP...

 

 

 

And also that you could have gotten a way better PSU for the same money from other manufacturers.

It doesn't exist in a vacuum where only one manufacturer exist, there is competition and it has to be measured by what you can get from other Manufacturers.

 

Why would you get an M12II-Bronze 520W for 50€ when you can get a Pure Power 11/400W for a bit less or 500W System Power 9. Or Corsair CX450 wich are far better??

There's a ton of PSU for that money that are better!

 

 

 

Anyway, here more Infos:

 

[Stefan Payne]

11 hours ago, LukeSavenije said:

group regulation, no uvp or ocp and a 10 year old design

you call that okay?

Its Seasonic, it has to be OK.

And that is the Problem with "Brand Loyalty", that those brands that are regarded highly can sell worse stuff for more money than other Brands and to make it worse - get away with it.

The "mistake" on the Label is a pretty big deal IMO.

Claiming two to four +12V Rails on the Label but none is inside because no OCP anywhere is just bad. There is no excuse to do that, ever.

 

Something from Jonnyguru:

Quote

Is it true that some PSU's that claim to be multiple +12V rails don't have the +12V rail split at all? 

Yes, this is true. But it's the exception and not the norm. It's typically seen in Seasonic built units (like the Corsair HX and Antec True Power Trio.) It's actually cheaper to make a single +12V rail PSU because you forego all of the components used in splitting up and limiting each rail and this may be one reason some OEM's will not split the rails, but say they are split. Some system builders adhere very closely to ATX12V specification for liability reasons, so a company that wants to get that business but also save money and reduce R&D costs will often "fib" and say the PSU has it's +12V split when it does not. 

Why don't those PSU companies get in trouble? Because Intel actually lifted the split +12V rail requirement from spec, but they didn't actually "announce" it. They just changed the verbiage from "required" to "recommended" leaving system builders a bit confused as to what the specification really is.

source:

http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?3990-Single-vs-Multiple-12V-rails-The-splitting-of-the-12V-rail

 

[aldysts92]

On 5/17/2019 at 12:50 PM, LukeSavenije said:

don't

 

m12ii is a 10 year old design that isn't made with modern hardware in mind at all. it lacks protections, has group regulation and should've been stopped selling 5 years ago. get yourself some quality unit

 

and it wasn't that far off in recommendation, but I'd get 550+ watts, tier b or higher

 

On 5/17/2019 at 3:32 PM, Stefan Payne said:

outervision...

Why are people still trusting that shit?
Its grossly overestimating...

 

The M12II Bronze is a pretty shitty unit for the price, probably the worst you can get for the money as its more a low end topology with a bit of Lipstick on it. And people fall for the "Wapanese" Capacitors, that are also made in china.

But it doesn't have UVP on 12V, doesn't have OCP and neither OTP. 

And its group regulated. 

 

Such "features" you usually see in 30€ PSU or so. So no, its a bad PSU and you have to Upgrade because you got a dud at the time!
Everything else from named brands in the same price range is better for years - much better!

Its like comparing a Lada to normal "named Car Brands" such as Ford and look in the 15-20k Price region.

 

AS for the PSU:
Quality >>>>>>>>>>> Quantity

a good quality 400-450W PSU is enough for most Mid Range systems, if they are good enough.

A good quality 500-600W PSU is all you'd ever want/need for a Consumer Desktop System with the normal Consumer Socket.

Yeah I will looking for new PSU then. But is it okay to use my RTX 2070 Zotac Mini on my system with Seasonic M12ii 520W Bronze while waiting for new PSU?

My  current specs :

i7 8700k

MSI Gaming M5 Z370

2x8GB Corsair RGB 3200mhz

H100i v2

TP Link ARcher T9E PCie

MOnitor : Aorus AD27QD

Steelseries Artics 7

Corsair k70 RGB Keyboard

Logitech Z323 Speaker

Corsair 460X Case

 

Never Overclock. Is it safe to use for a while before upgrading to new PSU? (on bequiet site estimate wattage is 393 watt , on pc partpicker 424W )

 

 

 

[Ankerson]

14 minutes ago, aldysts92 said:

 

Yeah I will looking for new PSU then. But is it okay to use my RTX 2070 Zotac Mini on my system with Seasonic M12ii 520W Bronze while waiting for new PSU?

My  current specs :

i7 8700k

MSI Gaming M5 Z370

2x8GB Corsair RGB 3200mhz

H100i v2

TP Link ARcher T9E PCie

MOnitor : Aorus AD27QD

Steelseries Artics 7

Corsair k70 RGB Keyboard

Logitech Z323 Speaker

Corsair 460X Case

 

Never Overclock. Is it safe to use for a while before upgrading to new PSU? (on bequiet site estimate wattage is 393 watt , on pc partpicker 424W )

 

 

 

 

I wouldn't use it personally, no.

 

It's a little tight as far as wattage goes.

 

You can try it if you want, it won't hurt the system, but if you experience any sort of issue stop using the GPU until your new PSU comes in.

 

Again I recommend waiting until you get your new PSU.

 

If it was the M12II 620W I would say for it, but it's not.

[Vejnemojnen]

I was browsing through a webstore's options yesterday, and found Antec Earthwatts Pro Gold 550w semi-modular PSU for very good price. How would this unit compare to PurePower11 or Bitfenix WhisperM? According to the tier list, it's tier A, which would make it recommandeable.

 

TIA

[aldysts92]

1 hour ago, Ankerson said:

 

I wouldn't use it personally, no.

 

It's a little tight as far as wattage goes.

 

You can try it if you want, it won't hurt the system, but if you experience any sort of issue stop using the GPU until your new PSU comes in.

 

Again I recommend waiting until you get your new PSU.

 

If it was the M12II 620W I would say for it, but it's not.

Haha okay then. RM650X on its way. I think i will just wait for my PSu coming before using my rtx..too scared if anything happen to other components even tough i never overclock

[LukeSavenije]

9 minutes ago, aldysts92 said:

Haha okay then. RM650X on its way. I think i will just wait for my PSu coming before using my rtx..too scared if anything happen to other components even tough i never overclock

you should try

 

if you don't do stupid voltages, nothing can really happen

[LienusLateTips]

1 hour ago, Vejnemojnen said:

I was browsing through a webstore's options yesterday, and found Antec Earthwatts Pro Gold 550w semi-modular PSU for very good price. How would this unit compare to PurePower11 or Bitfenix WhisperM? According to the tier list, it's tier A, which would make it recommandeable.

 

TIA

Focus Gold rebrand. It's ok. It's pretty nice unit, but has the usually Focus ripple issues.

[Vejnemojnen]

31 minutes ago, LienusLateTips said:

Focus Gold rebrand. It's ok. It's pretty nice unit, but has the usually Focus ripple issues.

Thank you! As it is so much cheaper than FPG or Bitfenix WhisperM or even Corsair TXM, I'd say it is a great choice. Good to know it has reasonable quality as well.

[LienusLateTips]

1 minute ago, Vejnemojnen said:

Thank you! As it is so much cheaper than FPG or Bitfenix WhisperM or even Corsair TXM, I'd say it is a great choice. Good to know it has reasonable quality as well.

If it's like 20 euros or less, I'd still go for the Whisper M, or others in it's class. Even a MWE Gold.

[Stefan Payne]

5 hours ago, aldysts92 said:

Yeah I will looking for new PSU then. But is it okay to use my RTX 2070 Zotac Mini on my system with Seasonic M12ii 520W Bronze while waiting for new PSU?

I wouldn't do that to be honest.

The 2070 is a modern card with modern power saving Mechanisms, the M12II is an old design that was made before Kepler introduced more agressive Power Saving Mechanism in GPUs.

and also before Haswell, wich also introduced some more agressive power saving Mechanisms.

[Stefan Payne]

5 hours ago, Ankerson said:

It's a little tight as far as wattage goes.

Nope, its not. Wattage is fine, Design of the PSU is not.

Quote

If it was the M12II 620W I would say for it, but it's not.

620W is the same bad electronics, just 100W more.

The 650W would have been fine but that one was EOL'd quickly.

Here, for your information:

 

And Brand Loyalty allows companys to make shittier products at higher prices!

 

2 hours ago, Vejnemojnen said:

Thank you! As it is so much cheaper than FPG or Bitfenix WhisperM or even Corsair TXM, I'd say it is a great choice. Good to know it has reasonable quality as well.

Bitfenix Formula also exist.

That is an option. Might not work too well with highest end GPUs but there are no known issues with the other units you mentioned.

 

OK, Corsair TXm has rather high fan speed. BUt that's about it.

 

Thing is that there is a shit ton of "great choice" PSU from various manufacturers.

 

Cougar GX-F is not available in Europe no more, sadly...

[aldysts92]

1 hour ago, Stefan Payne said:

I wouldn't do that to be honest.

The 2070 is a modern card with modern power saving Mechanisms, the M12II is an old design that was made before Kepler introduced more agressive Power Saving Mechanism in GPUs.

and also before Haswell, wich also introduced some more agressive power saving Mechanisms.

Ok I will patiently wait then hahahaha. RM650X is good one right? For now or even next few years for maybe another upgrading other components such as new cpu/gpu?

[LukeSavenije]

3 minutes ago, aldysts92 said:

Ok I will patiently wait then hahahaha. RM650X is good one right? For now or even next few years for maybe another upgrading other components such as new cpu/gpu?

yeah, rmx is something that should least for 7+ years, based off a solid CWT

 

and of course is haswell/kepler certified

[Vejnemojnen]

4 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

Bitfenix Formula also exist.

That is an option. Might not work too well with highest end GPUs but there are no known issues with the other units you mentioned.

 

OK, Corsair TXm has rather high fan speed. BUt that's about it.

 

Thing is that there is a shit ton of "great choice" PSU from various manufacturers.

Indeed, I was often recommending Formula Gold locally, as their 450-550w units are probably the best by terms of price to performance ratio, and also extremely quiet. I just wanted to know, whether the antec earthwatts would be a fine recommendation as well. BUT, realized that it's not a good idea: 2 years warranty, instead of 5 (bitfenix) or 7 (corsair tx) or 10 years (seasonic, corsair rmx). And even though antec is cheaper, but only by a minor margin.

[LogicWeasel]

In all of this re-hashed discussion of the dreaded "Super-old M12II Seasonic PSU" I can't help but feel like my substance-post about Rosewill PSUs got buried: 

 

https://linustechtips.com/main/topic/1045610-new-psu-tier-list/?do=findComment&amp;comment=12575132

 

Was there any input on this as I was surprised to see no one reply/comment on the questions I raised in my post.  If no one cares I'll give up but I thought I raised a few valid thoughts that there are 5+ Rosewill models missing from the tier list and some look like they may be worth including.