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CarlBar

Metro Exodus Benchmarks

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1 minute ago, Brooksie359 said:

That's like saying 4k is an issue because it doesn't show on a 1080p monitor. At some point you need a good monitor to properly show certain advances in gaming. I can't run HDR10 on my 1080p tn monitor so I guess HDR10 has issues. 

Considering there's almost no true HDR monitors on the market yet, HDR has issues for a while.

 

Main thing is monitors are the last thing that people tend to upgrade. By the time RTX won't have issues, DXR should be pretty standard. I guess that works. But it's "interesting" tech for another 2 generations.

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Just now, Taf the Ghost said:

Considering there's almost no true HDR monitors on the market yet, HDR has issues for a while.

 

Main thing is monitors are the last thing that people tend to upgrade. By the time RTX won't have issues, DXR should be pretty standard. I guess that works. But it's "interesting" tech for another 2 generations.

As someone who owns a pg27uq I would highly disagree. That's like saying 4k is an issue when there wasn't many 4k monitors on the market. HDR10 absolutely amazing and I didn't even think about HDR when buying the monitor. I just wanted a 4k 120hz monitor but after trying HDR out I can say that alone Is worth the price tag of the monitor for me. Calling a technology defective because not all monitors can utilize it is actually one of the dumbest things I have ever heard of. I only use my 1080p tn monitor when playing esport games because if you want to experience cinematic games you really want an ips or va display. 

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2 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

As someone who owns a pg27uq I would highly disagree. That's like saying 4k is an issue when there wasn't many 4k monitors on the market. HDR10 absolutely amazing and I didn't even think about HDR when buying the monitor. I just wanted a 4k 120hz monitor but after trying HDR out I can say that alone Is worth the price tag of the monitor for me. Calling a technology defective because not all monitors can utilize it is actually one of the dumbest things I have ever heard of. I only use my 1080p tn monitor when playing esport games because if you want to experience cinematic games you really want an ips or va display. 

There's a lot of amazing tech at the bleeding edge, but stuff doesn't stick around without a profitable niche or mass-market utility. I never said it was defective; don't put words in my posts that I didn't make. I said it was "an issue" because it is. The monitor market clearly views ~350USD at the upper end for Mainstream. It's going to be a while before the tech is cheap enough, probably 2 years at 1440p and 3 years at 4K, that you see it useful for anything but 2k+ USD systems. That puts it probably into 2 generations of Nvidia parts after what we're at currently before there is heavy market.

 

That two generations should move 2080 performance to roughly the xx60 price category along with two generations improved DXR performance, which will make DXR lighting effects viable and usable at the price category that makes sense for all games to start carrying implementations. For now, they're ultra-high-end experiences and tech demos, though Tim at HUB said that Metro's HDR implementation is really good. It's probably worth a purchase for someone with your setup.

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2 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

There's a lot of amazing tech at the bleeding edge, but stuff doesn't stick around without a profitable niche or mass-market utility. I never said it was defective; don't put words in my posts that I didn't make. I said it was "an issue" because it is. The monitor market clearly views ~350USD at the upper end for Mainstream. It's going to be a while before the tech is cheap enough, probably 2 years at 1440p and 3 years at 4K, that you see it useful for anything but 2k+ USD systems. That puts it probably into 2 generations of Nvidia parts after what we're at currently before there is heavy market.

 

That two generations should move 2080 performance to roughly the xx60 price category along with two generations improved DXR performance, which will make DXR lighting effects viable and usable at the price category that makes sense for all games to start carrying implementations. For now, they're ultra-high-end experiences and tech demos, though Tim at HUB said that Metro's HDR implementation is really good. It's probably worth a purchase for someone with your setup.

I didn't even think about if metro had HDR or not. Rtx plus HDR will be interesting because maybe it will make a more noticeable difference between rtx on vs rtx off. I was on the fence about getting it but I guess I will get it today. I was planning on playing anthem tonight but I guess I might have to change my plans. The one thing that makes me think HDR doesn't have an issue with few monitors supporting it is because a surprising amount of games support HDR even if not many monitors support it yet. 

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Looks promising for me and the 1440p 144hz crowd, can't wait to try it out


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3 minutes ago, Brooksie359 said:

I didn't even think about if metro had HDR or not. Rtx plus HDR will be interesting because maybe it will make a more noticeable difference between rtx on vs rtx off. I was on the fence about getting it but I guess I will get it today. I was planning on playing anthem tonight but I guess I might have to change my plans. The one thing that makes me think HDR doesn't have an issue with few monitors supporting it is because a surprising amount of games support HDR even if not many monitors support it yet. 

"Support" and "doesn't look like crap" are, unfortunately for anyone that's been around graphics tech for a while, not the same thing. 

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Posted · Original PosterOP

IMO i think AMD's guy hit the nail on the head vis a vis it needing RT to be available at all price points before it will become mainstream. But not for the reasons you might think.

 

The most significant advantage for RT as i understand it is that once you start implementing more than one effect type via RT you significantly cut the overheads in development time and cost to do to get a high level of effect quality. The problem is until it becomes a bit more widespread at the low and mid end points they can't eliminate traditional methods of doing those effects so it's just extra work for the devs. But once it gets support down at everything above integrated graphics then they're going to be able to effectively kill off non-DXR methods of achieving the effects. That will have major consequences IMO.

 

Also Hardware Unboxed has a video out now, not watched it yet:

 

 

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3 minutes ago, CarlBar said:

IMO i think AMD's guy hit the nail on the head vis a vis it needing RT to be available at all price points before it will become mainstream. But not for the reasons you might think.

 

The most significant advantage for RT as i understand it is that once you start implementing more than one effect type via RT you significantly cut the overheads in development time and cost to do to get a high level of effect quality. The problem is until it becomes a bit more widespread at the low and mid end points they can't eliminate traditional methods of doing those effects so it's just extra work for the devs. But once it gets support down at everything above integrated graphics then they're going to be able to effectively kill off non-DXR methods of achieving the effects. That will have major consequences IMO.

 

Also Hardware Unboxed has a video out now, not watched it yet:

 

 

DXR is 7nm tech, with some really big die 16nm GPUs that can do a bit, but it's also pretty clear there's a pipeline bottleneck involved still. That isn't too surprising, as this is Nvidia's first gen Async, but GN mentioned that with nothing visible on the screen, there's still the performance penalty. RTX will work a lot better after Nvidia goes to 7nm with pipeline fixes.

 

Though the main thing is that with Async now on Nvidia hardware, all of the new games are going to prioritize actually using it. (Partially because Nvidia is going to pay for it to happen, as it'll make Pascal look significantly slower; we've already seen that with some of the variable shader culling in Wolfenstein making the 2060 beat the 1080.) This means a lot of tasks are going to be moved off to Compute functions where it's more efficient to do. This is actually good in general, as Nvidia was again holding back tech. (Which they'll end up doing with DXR, more than likely, as well.)

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43 minutes ago, Taf the Ghost said:

"Support" and "doesn't look like crap" are, unfortunately for anyone that's been around graphics tech for a while, not the same thing. 

It looks good if you have the proper monitor so the technology itself doesn't look bad it's just that most monitors don't display it properly or don't support it. 

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1 minute ago, Brooksie359 said:

It looks good if you have the proper monitor so the technology itself doesn't look bad it's just that most monitors don't display it properly or don't support it. 

Well, the first major game with HDR support was Mass Effect Andromeda, to my knowledge. That probably didn't help matters.

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1 hour ago, Taf the Ghost said:

Well, the first major game with HDR support was Mass Effect Andromeda, to my knowledge. That probably didn't help matters.

Yeah I haven't played those. For me both BF1 and BFV have really incredible HDR. The newest assassins creed also looks amazing with HDR and I had heard the origins was good as well. I really like the implementation in farcry5 but I will say it's a bit too bright because it actually feels like you are looking at the sun when you look at the sun in game granted I have a 1000 nit monitor. I tried shadow of war and I thought it was a good deal better than it without but it wasn't as night and day as it was with the others. Destiny 2 was similar with it looking noticeably better but it wasn't night and day for me. Overall HDR has been great for me and I really do hope that others can experience true HDR without having to pay 2000 dollars on a monitor but idk how long that will be. 

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