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Windows 10 May Reserve Another 7GB For Updates.

Uttamattamakin
Go to solution Solved by LAwLz,
7 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

Yeah, when hardware was expensive, higher dev costs made more sense. As hardware gets cheaper, high dev costs no longer make sense.

I understand that, but when you are a software company, which is by far the most widely used PC operating system, then maybe you should invest some money into optimizing it.

"It costs money" is to me not a valid excuse for doing a poor job. Again, imagine if Volkswagen used that excuse for poor miles per gallon results compared to their competitors.

"It costs a lot of money to make the engines more efficient".

 

And yes I understand that Microsoft makes money basically regardless of how well optimized Windows is. I can understand business decisions for how to allocate resources without having to agree with it. What I am saying here is that I wish Microsoft would take better care of Windows than they do.

 

As a consumer and user of their product, I don't really care how much money they make from something. What I care about is how good the product is. I am not here to argue how Microsoft can create a product I will buy with as little effort as possible. I am here to voice my opinion about how I think Microsoft should make the product better for me. I am not employed by Microsoft so I don't have any obligation to defend them. I am a user so I should express what I want.

9 minutes ago, leadeater said:

they most certainly do and is common

Not in my country AFAIK.... And even if it is its still a scummy move from MS to force ppl to throw away their perfectly functioning laptop just because they are lazy AF and cant make a proper update system that isnt a resource hog....

 

/EDIT

BTW i know many students who dont have a loan and learn beside a full time job... (Im in this group too.)

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4 minutes ago, TechyBen said:

Your comment on getting a loan was in defense of MS rollout of OSs... so... yeah.

No, it actually had nothing to do with it, I mean that is what the topic was about but the comment was directly addressing the ability for students to buy laptops/computers. If you wish to apply that wider than which was actually said you're free to do that.

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8 minutes ago, jagdtigger said:

BTW i know many students who dont have a loan and learn beside a full time job... (Im in this group too.)

Now apply that across your entire course of students, the entire institution, the country, across other developed countries. In the statistical sense, not personal experience, what kind of percentage do you think it is? (talking about computer ownership not loans) As you widen the scope that result will change, if you narrow in but look at different places that will also change. Everywhere is going to be slightly different but there are commonalities between them all, shift in computer aided education via multiple factors.

 

For Microsoft the education sector world wide is one of their largest markets, I would also say it is their most important.

 

Now the reason I brought up the course related costs is an example of how students can get money to buy something like a laptop. This isn't unique to my country either and other places have differing methods but world wide I would not say students in higher education have a general inability to buy something like a laptop. Where I work we have around 30,000 enrolled students and we sure as heck do not have that many computers for student usage, in total including staff computers we have around 9,000.

 

I know student device ownership rates in NZ, AUS and UK are very similar and I wouldn't expect US to be much different. Looking wider than that I would also expect a number of European countries to be similar in that regard too.

 

The poor student is a common trope but when it comes to course related resources those tend to be well covered, unlike food and accommodation etc. Students are a living breathing pile of money and many organizations try and take a share of that money, Microsoft being one of them. That's my rather morbid view of what students are anyway.

 

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17 minutes ago, leadeater said:

-snip-

Even the more better situated students will go reluctant to change their laptop just because of MS AFAIK (even my father who could easily afford it but he refuses to change out that ancient laptop(E-450 APU, slow as hell) he uses even though its starting to fall apart, it has to be totally dead for him to change his mind). They will use it until the PC is BER....

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7 hours ago, TechyBen said:

 

 

Educate your users. If you cannot, then you don't deserve to force it on them.

As said. They can take 700gb if they wish, or the OS needs it. However, if they do it without permission, then that gets flakey.

Where does it say they are doing it without permission? When you agree to updates you agree to this. Reserved space is nothing new either.

 

5 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

Yeah, like students/low income ppl could afford to buy a new laptop on MS's whim.... /s

Stop generalizing. If you can’t afford a $100 computer then you have bigger issues than windows update.

 

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3 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

Stop generalizing. If you can’t afford a $100 computer then you have bigger issues than windows update.

And you should stop ignoring facts. MS even supported these machines with free/dirt cheap licence's, and now they want to force the users to throw them away. Guess how many of them will do, my bet is on the other option where they are going to use it even without updates.

And let me turn the tables on you, why should anyone toss away things that perfectly working and satisfies their needs just to waste money on a marginally better product? 9_9 It seems to me you cant comprehend the value of money, and how hard it is to get. Not to mention the even harder part, resist the urge to buy things so you can have savings.

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1 minute ago, jagdtigger said:

And you should stop ignoring facts. MS even supported these machines with free/dirt cheap licence's, and now they want to force the users to throw them away. Guess how many of them will do, my bet is on the other option where they are going to use it even without updates.

Exactly, if you can't afford an upgrade then you don't be worried about updates. 

1 minute ago, jagdtigger said:

And let me turn the tables on you, why should anyone toss away things that perfectly working and satisfies their needs just to waste money on a marginally better product? 9_9 It seems to me you cant comprehend the value of money, and how hard it is to get. Not to mention the even harder part, resist the urge to buy things so you can have savings.

If you work hard in life, it's not so difficult to get. If you can't afford a computer, then don't get one. It's one thing to not have the money, but it changes with the underlying reason. If you are good with money, you will do your research before buying and buy a computer that will last a while. This is 2019 now, and computers with at least 64GB drive space, which is fine for this update (depending on use case of course, but beggars can't be choosers) have been around for a very, very long time. People throw away computers with more hard drive space. 

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31 minutes ago, RorzNZ said:

If you can't afford a computer, then don't get one.

*sigh* You still ignoring the reality... Nowadays internat and a pc isnt an option, its a necessity!

31 minutes ago, RorzNZ said:

f you are good with money, you will do your research before buying and buy a computer that will last a while.

Again, for a normie 32 GB just fine(and at the time was cheap with good enough speed for them). The problem here is Win10. Its 3+ years old but its still a buggy bloated mess that takes up a lot of space for no good reason.

 

/EDIT

Example:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hwsuo9l2ckx3jf4/shitware.PNG?dl=0

 

Just those good for nothing crapware apps eating up almost 3 GB....

Edited by jagdtigger
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15 hours ago, TechyBen said:

I have seen Windows 10 forced update crush at least 2 people. Now, in your opinion, considering they were using MS OS that had no forced update, and MS changed that system mid stream... what should I think about it? MS decision, to not give choice, has caused actual harm to people I know.

 

How am I over generalising? There are multiple OSs that offer this choice (iOS, Android, Linux, etc). Some do not allow rollbacks, some do. The 7GB cache (with options I add!!) is a good idea. Forcing the update, or any other, is a poor implementation.

 

 

All that has been addressed in this thread already.

Grammar and spelling is not indicative of intelligence/knowledge.  Not having the same opinion does not always mean lack of understanding.  

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3 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

*sigh* You still ignoring the reality... Nowadays internat and a pc isnt an option, its a necessity!

Not really. Go to a library and use their computers. Use your phone for e-mail. 

3 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

Again, for a normie 32 GB just fine(and at the time was cheap with good enough speed for them). The problem here is Win10. Its 3+ years old but its still a buggy bloated mess that takes up a lot of space for no good reason.

32GB hasn't been fine since 2008. 

3 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

/EDIT

Example:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hwsuo9l2ckx3jf4/shitware.PNG?dl=0

 

Just those good for nothing crapware apps eating up almost 3 GB....

Windows isn't made to be lightweight. 

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1 minute ago, RorzNZ said:

Not really.

That's my slogan.

 

 

But in all honesty, the whole "Internet and PCs and are a necessity and/or a human right" is a load of bullshit. Their luxuries, nothing more, and that won't change.

Come Bloody Angel

Break off your chains

And look what I've found in the dirt.

 

Pale battered body

Seems she was struggling

Something is wrong with this world.

 

Fierce Bloody Angel

The blood is on your hands

Why did you come to this world?

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

The blood is on your hands.

 

The blood is on your hands!

 

Pyo.

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1 hour ago, Drak3 said:

That's my slogan.

 

 

But in all honesty, the whole "Internet and PCs and are a necessity and/or a human right" is a load of bullshit. Their luxuries, nothing more, and that won't change.

I have to say, it is getting harder and harder to function in society without access to the internet.   I'm not saying you have to buy a pc or internet connection to get it (Libraries and schools offer free internet),  But when centrlink (social security office) installs pc's for people to look up jobs and access their online services you know it has become an integral part of functioning.   So while I agree owning a decent PC is a luxury, having access to the internet is probably closer to an essential service.  

 

 

Grammar and spelling is not indicative of intelligence/knowledge.  Not having the same opinion does not always mean lack of understanding.  

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5 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

32GB hasn't been fine since 2008. 

Our standard VM template for Windows Server 2008 originally started with 40GB system disk, that's all that is ever on this disk. It only took a few years for that space to fill up and we had to expand every VM over time to 80GB and we updated the VM template to 80GB.

 

40GB isn't enough for a stock + updated Windows Server 2008/2008 R2, Windows Vista and Windows 7 so it's not enough for Windows 10 either.

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9 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

*sigh* You still ignoring the reality... Nowadays internat and a pc isnt an option, its a necessity!

Again, for a normie 32 GB just fine(and at the time was cheap with good enough speed for them). The problem here is Win10. Its 3+ years old but its still a buggy bloated mess that takes up a lot of space for no good reason.

 

/EDIT

Example:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hwsuo9l2ckx3jf4/shitware.PNG?dl=0

 

Just those good for nothing crapware apps eating up almost 3 GB....

32GB isn't fine at all unless you really, but really rely on cloud services which I think for many isn't true. Perhaps now we finally don't see that many 32GB devices pop-up again. Besides, it isn't just Windows 10 that has this problem, even Windows 8 or hell Windows 7 would already take up much space. You'd only have a few gigs left for other potential necessary software that you require. 

Desktops

 

- The specifications of my almighty machine:

MB: MSI Z370-A Pro || CPU: Intel Core i3 8350K 4.00 GHz || RAM: 20GB DDR4  || GPU: Nvidia GeForce GTX1070 || Storage: 1TB HDD & 250GB HDD  & 128GB x2 SSD || OS: Windows 10 Pro & Ubuntu 21.04

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1 hour ago, Master Delta Chief said:

32GB isn't fine at all unless you really, but really rely on cloud services which I think for many isn't true. Perhaps now we finally don't see that many 32GB devices pop-up again. Besides, it isn't just Windows 10 that has this problem, even Windows 8 or hell Windows 7 would already take up much space. You'd only have a few gigs left for other potential necessary software that you require. 

Win7 would occupy only half of that, IDK abot 8. But 10 with this extra 7 gig is really pushing it. BTW most normies upload everything into the cloud(not knowing how bad this idea is).

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5 hours ago, mr moose said:

Libraries and schools offer free internet

Yeah, doing your personal business where anyone can read it is a very good idea... /s Not to mention that those things are a malware fest usually.

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7 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

Not really. Go to a library and use their computers. Use your phone for e-mail. 

See my previous reply....

 

7 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

32GB hasn't been fine since 2008.

Viewing FB, reading mails, watching YT. This covers a whole lot of ppl and for this 32 GB is more than enough. Most ppl has an external storage device so they can carry it with themselves(just my experience).

 

7 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

Windows isn't made to be lightweight. 

More precisely at first it was made light, but as time passed and MS got their monopoly they got lazy and windows became a clusterf?ck of spaghetti code.

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4 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

Viewing FB, reading mails, watching YT. This covers a whole lot of ppl and for this 32 GB is more than enough. Most ppl has an external storage device so they can carry it with themselves(just my experience).

Then 32gb is still fine.

 

 

PSU Tier List | CoC

Gaming Build | FreeNAS Server

Spoiler

i5-4690k || Seidon 240m || GTX780 ACX || MSI Z97s SLI Plus || 8GB 2400mhz || 250GB 840 Evo || 1TB WD Blue || H440 (Black/Blue) || Windows 10 Pro || Dell P2414H & BenQ XL2411Z || Ducky Shine Mini || Logitech G502 Proteus Core

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1 minute ago, 79wjd said:

 

Then 32gb is still fine.

 

 

The thing I find funniest is that what few Windows 10 machines running 32GB are usually more expensive than some slightler older Toshiba and HP laptops that came with 500GB spinners.

Come Bloody Angel

Break off your chains

And look what I've found in the dirt.

 

Pale battered body

Seems she was struggling

Something is wrong with this world.

 

Fierce Bloody Angel

The blood is on your hands

Why did you come to this world?

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

The blood is on your hands.

 

The blood is on your hands!

 

Pyo.

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20 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

32GB hasn't been fine since 2008. 

i can fit a Linux distro with a web browser just fine with 32gb. probably have more than half left over. 

especially if i start off with a commandline only distro, and just install a window manager and a web browser. 

 

8 hours ago, Drak3 said:

The thing I find funniest is that what few Windows 10 machines running 32GB are usually more expensive than some slightler older Toshiba and HP laptops that came with 500GB spinners.

that's because hdd's are cheap. for good reason. they are slow and are the worst choice ever for a portable system as they are extremely fragile. 

She/Her

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11 minutes ago, firelighter487 said:

they are extremely fragile

People keep saying that, and I've yet to see a laptop fail due to HDD breaking without said laptop being subject to the type of abuse that will kill most devices in roughly the same time frame anyways.

 

12 minutes ago, firelighter487 said:

they are slow

You want fast storage, shell out for fast storage.

Come Bloody Angel

Break off your chains

And look what I've found in the dirt.

 

Pale battered body

Seems she was struggling

Something is wrong with this world.

 

Fierce Bloody Angel

The blood is on your hands

Why did you come to this world?

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

Everybody turns to dust.

 

The blood is on your hands.

 

The blood is on your hands!

 

Pyo.

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3 minutes ago, Drak3 said:

You want fast storage, shell out for fast storage.

I want mass fast storage and I want Microsoft to pay for it.

PSU Tier List | CoC

Gaming Build | FreeNAS Server

Spoiler

i5-4690k || Seidon 240m || GTX780 ACX || MSI Z97s SLI Plus || 8GB 2400mhz || 250GB 840 Evo || 1TB WD Blue || H440 (Black/Blue) || Windows 10 Pro || Dell P2414H & BenQ XL2411Z || Ducky Shine Mini || Logitech G502 Proteus Core

Spoiler

FreeNAS 9.3 - Stable || Xeon E3 1230v2 || Supermicro X9SCM-F || 32GB Crucial ECC DDR3 || 3x4TB WD Red (JBOD) || SYBA SI-PEX40064 sata controller || Corsair CX500m || NZXT Source 210.

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2 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

 

I want mass fast storage and I want Microsoft to pay for it.

well meme'd

Our Grace. The Feathered One. He shows us the way. His bob is majestic and shows us the path. Follow unto his guidance and His example. He knows the one true path. Our Saviour. Our Grace. Our Father Birb has taught us with His humble heart and gentle wing the way of the bob. Let us show Him our reverence and follow in His example. The True Path of the Feathered One. ~ Dimboble-dubabob III

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8 hours ago, 79wjd said:

Then 32gb is still fine.

Would be fine without MS's laziness....

 

9 minutes ago, firelighter487 said:

i can fit a Linux distro with a web browser just fine with 32gb. probably have more than half left over.  

especially if i start off with a commandline only distro, and just install a window manager and a web browser. 

Actually installing kubuntu "as is" is only 8 GB (even less with the minimal installation option, but in this mode it only installs a web browser and some basic tools). Pretty small for a fully setup OS with office and everything.

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