NVIDIA finally officially supports Adaptive Sync (with a small catch)

[Enochian]

it's gonna by like a lottery ticket. We can sub the results here

[Trixanity]

Hell has frozen over. Second time recently that Nvidia adopts the open approach (first being open sourcing the otherwise dead PhysX).

 

Despite the guaranteed quality, the price for using a FPGA was idiotic. 

 

Freesync is a superset of Adaptive Sync. It's basically the same but with added certification for stuff like LFC, HDR and all that jazz.

[LAwLz]

1 hour ago, S w a t s o n said:

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Also I stole this me- I mean, I made this

 

 

What's even funnier is that AMD did not make FreeSync. It's a VESA standard they repurposed and branded, after Nvidia had already released G-Sync.

 

 

30 minutes ago, Derangel said:

If my memory is accurate, I believe first gen G-sync modules cost monitor OEMs something like $150-$200 per module. I'd imagine that cost went up with versions 2 and 3. 

Yes but that makes the assumption that implementing FreeSync is free, which it isn't.

The scalars that support variable refresh rate are not free, the hardware for frame duplication is not free, and the strobing backlight is not free either.

If you compare the worst and cheapest possible implementation of FreeSync to G-Sync then yes it will be very cheap to implement, but if you want to make a Freesync monitor with feature parity to a G-Sync monitor then it will cost a bit. Maybe not 200 dollars, but the difference between G-Sync and FreeSync won't be as big as the cost of the G-Sync module.

 

What I'm trying to say is that the bill of materials (BOM) might look like this (numbers completely made up just to illustrate a point).

Normal monitor - 150 dollar BOM.

Cheapest and simplest FreeSync monitor - 160 dollar BOM.

G-Sync monitor - 350 dollar BOM.

FreeSync monitor with the same features as a G-Sync monitor - 270 dollar BOM

 

So even if the G-Sync module costs 200 dollars, the difference is 80 dollars.

 

 

37 minutes ago, GoldenLag said:

Freesync 2 has low framerate compensation unlike freesync 1.

 

Gsync was better than Freesync, but Freesync 2 has brought them to parity.

 

Afaik at least, please correct me if im wrong

But from what I know, it was not impossible to implement low frame rate compensation with Freesync 1.

I am mostly guessing here, but I think AMD just added the low frame rate compensation as a requirement to the FreeSync 2 classification, without making any changes to the Adaptive-Sync standard.

 

You have to separate the technical standards and protocols from what requirements AMD says you need to have to be classified as FreeSync 1 or 2.

I'm just talking about the protocols here. AMD could say all FreeSync 2 monitors needed to be in red and ship with a "Freesync" sticker in the box, but that would not be a technical limitation, just a requirement AMD imposes to call it FreeSync 2.

[D13H4RD]

One thing curious 

 

Certain FreeSync monitors support adaptive sync over HDMI while G-SYNC only works over DP. 

 

Wonder what's the case for this one. 

[orbitalbuzzsaw]

Hey, Nvidia making an announcement of a feature worth using for once

[mr moose]

38 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

What's even funnier is that AMD did not make FreeSync. It's a VESA standard they repurposed and branded, after Nvidia had already released G-Sync.

 

 

 

And made very little money from in a time when R+D cash was rare, revenue was down, products were at best rebranded 3 year old tech barely holding their ground and most economists had them pinned for going bankrupt.   It's really hard to see the logic in AMD decisions and easy to see why they have been playing catch up for the better part of 9 years now. 

 

Thank fuck they had a win with ryzen, because that may well have been the end of them.  

 

 

[Settlerteo]

21 minutes ago, mr moose said:

And made very little money from in a time when R+D cash was rare, revenue was down, products were at best rebranded 3 year old tech barely holding their ground and most economists had them pinned for going bankrupt. 

 

 

Are these claims based on facts and real articles because this is rather informative(i mean about revenue and bankruptcy).

P.S. I also think they had a win with 470/480/570/580 mostly because of miners.

[Tellos]

Owns a Agon AG241QG4....well that purchase just got better,

[D13H4RD]

3 hours ago, Ja50n said:

Their implementation was far more expensive and no better in quality than a comparable FreeSync panel.

Technically, G-SYNC is superior. 

 

But is it like $200 superior? I reckon a lot of people would say no unless you can afford the premium and have an NVIDIA GPU. 

[Adramalech]

5 hours ago, mr moose said:

Nvidia have essentially bought the competition back to raw horsepower and RT  whilst making their money out of Gsync and investing nothing in freesync.

tell that to the people who bought a G sync monitor last week... it's horrible...

[79wjd]

12 minutes ago, Adramalech said:

tell that to the people who bought a G sync monitor last week... it's horrible...

Unfortunate for them, sure, but overall good for consumers.

 

Someone will always be hurt by any change to any product stack in any division.

[Brooksie359]

16 minutes ago, Adramalech said:

tell that to the people who bought a G sync monitor last week... it's horrible...

Honestly I have 2 gsync monitors and I don't really mind that I could have gotten a freesync instead. Although I got my 240hz gsync for 400 vs the freesync was 330 so it wasn't that big of a difference and I though mine looked a bit nicer. My other monitor doesn't have a freesync counterpart so can't really get mad until they come out with a freesync version of similar quality. 

[LAwLz]

2 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

Unfortunate for them, sure, but overall good for consumers.

 

Someone will always be hurt by any change to any product stack in any division.

I don't even think it's unfortunate for them. It's not like the products they own got worse in any way. Depending on which monitors they bought they might not have gained any alternatives either. Not all FreeSync and G-Sync monitors are the same.

 

Also, in EU we have a mandatory minimum 14 day return policy. If you have bought something then you are legally allowed to return it for a full refund as long as it happens within 14 days. The law also states that the return can be made for any reason, and without justification.

 

Spoiler

14 day cooling off period

In the EU you have the right to return purchases made online or through other types of distance selling, such as by phone, mail order or from a door-to-door salesperson, within 14 days for a full refund. You can do so for any reason – even if you simply changed your mind.

The 14-day cooling off period does not apply to all purchases. Some of the exemptions are:

• plane and train tickets, as well as concert tickets, hotel bookings, car rental reservations and catering services for specific dates
• goods and drinks delivered to you by regular delivery – for example delivery by a milkman
• goods made to order or clearly personalised – such as a tailor-made suit
• sealed audio, video or computer software, such as DVDs, which you have unsealed upon receipt
• online digital content, if you have already started downloading or streaming it and you agreed that you would lose your right of withdrawal by starting the performance
• goods bought from a private individual rather than a company
• urgent repairs and maintenance contracts – if you call a plumber to repair a leaking shower, you can't cancel the work once you have agreed on the price of the service

Please note that this list is not exhaustive.

The cooling off period expires 14 days after the day you received your goods. For service contracts, the cooling off period expires 14 days after the day you concluded the contract. If the cooling off period expires on a non-working day, your deadline is extended till the next working day.

 

[Adramalech]

13 minutes ago, 79wjd said:

Unfortunate for them, sure, but overall good for consumers.

well that's true...but what about me?!

now i'll have to point and laugh... ridicule and mock... on the floor laughing  out the phrase " you shoulda listened 300 bucks down the drain, FOR WHAT?"

posting pictures on instagram of your LG - 32GK850G-B with titles like "fml" or "why god why?" and the popular "but..."

seems like a lot of work...

*sigh* oh well, one foot in front of the other

[TVwazhere]

3 hours ago, D13H4RD said:

One thing curious 

 

Certain FreeSync monitors support adaptive sync over HDMI while G-SYNC only works over DP. 

 

Wonder what's the case for this one. 

Sadly I'll probably never find out with my current monitor, the VG248QE's DP port is dead  

 

I hope the MG279Q is supported. Difference between MG278Q is IPS rather than TN. And at $510 right now its the cheapest non-no-name brand I can find. 

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/c298TW/asus-monitor-mg279q

[D13H4RD]

1 minute ago, TVwazhere said:

I hope the MG279Q is supported. Difference between MG278Q is IPS rather than TN. And at $510 right now its the cheapest non-no-name brand I can find. 

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/c298TW/asus-monitor-mg279q

Can't hurt to try once the drivers are released 

[TVwazhere]

Just now, D13H4RD said:

Can't hurt to try once the drivers are released 

First lemme go get $500

 

If it does work though it could be a game changer in the long run. 

 

R7 3700 (wait for benchmarks)

1080ti

FreeSync Monitor

 

What a world we (could) live in...

[D13H4RD]

1 minute ago, TVwazhere said:

R7 3700 (wait for benchmarks)

1080ti

FreeSync Monitor

 

What a world we (could) live in...

Now you're speaking my language

[DocSwag]

And unfortunately only 10 series and 20 series cards are supported. I was excited since I have a freesync panel and a 970 until I found that out. Feelsbad

[Sauron]

Quote

Nvidia is crashing AMD’s FreeSync party

As if AMD had anything to lose from this... they offered it to nvidia since day one.

[Tech Enthusiast]

Amazing.

Basically we get a sticker on FreeSync monitors that will let us know if the thing is good, or crap.

Was crazy hard to find a good FreeSync monitor in the sea of craptastic ones.

[79wjd]

1 hour ago, LAwLz said:

I don't even think it's unfortunate for them. It's not like the products they own got worse in any way. Depending on which monitors they bought they might not have gained any alternatives either. Not all FreeSync and G-Sync monitors are the same.

 

Also, in EU we have a mandatory minimum 14 day return policy. If you have bought something then you are legally allowed to return it for a full refund as long as it happens within 14 days. The law also states that the return can be made for any reason, and without justification.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

14 day cooling off period

In the EU you have the right to return purchases made online or through other types of distance selling, such as by phone, mail order or from a door-to-door salesperson, within 14 days for a full refund. You can do so for any reason – even if you simply changed your mind.

The 14-day cooling off period does not apply to all purchases. Some of the exemptions are:

• plane and train tickets, as well as concert tickets, hotel bookings, car rental reservations and catering services for specific dates
• goods and drinks delivered to you by regular delivery – for example delivery by a milkman
• goods made to order or clearly personalised – such as a tailor-made suit
• sealed audio, video or computer software, such as DVDs, which you have unsealed upon receipt
• online digital content, if you have already started downloading or streaming it and you agreed that you would lose your right of withdrawal by starting the performance
• goods bought from a private individual rather than a company
• urgent repairs and maintenance contracts – if you call a plumber to repair a leaking shower, you can't cancel the work once you have agreed on the price of the service

Please note that this list is not exhaustive.

The cooling off period expires 14 days after the day you received your goods. For service contracts, the cooling off period expires 14 days after the day you concluded the contract. If the cooling off period expires on a non-working day, your deadline is extended till the next working day.

 

I'm not taking "week" literally, but rather the general idea of a recent purchase. And yes, they still got what they paid for and at a price that they were willing to pay and agreed to pay -- so there's nothing wrong there and they certainly didn't get cheated as they got exactly what they paid for. But I'd still can it unfortuante (by definition) if someone bought something and then only a short time later would they be able to buy something comparable enough for their use case for less.

[Enderman]

7 hours ago, D13H4RD said:

What's the main differences between VESA A-Sync and AMD FreeSync? 

 

Just wondering 

7 hours ago, porina said:

The name? Without digging I don't know either, but there was also FreeSync 2 with I think HDR support. Was that also standards based or an AMD extension to the VESA standard? Without looking it up, it is common for standards to have mandatory and optional parts, so maybe that's just a feature extension?

 

7 hours ago, LAwLz said:

From what I know, Freesync is just a marketing name AMD came up with for adaptive sync.

 

Be careful when looking at like that though. A lot of times when people compare prices between G-Sync and FreeSync monitors they forget things like all G-Sync monitors supporting strobing backlight, while only some FreeSync monitors supporting it (because it's something that has to be added separately).

 

It would be interesting to know what the actual price difference between G-Sync and FreeSync would be, if both monitors were otherwise identical. Not sure if anyone makes that though.

 

 

I haven't done that much digging, but from what I understand Adaptive-Sync works independently of the color information being transmitted. If that's the case then Adaptive-Sync supports any past and future color standards, and FreeSync 2 is just a marketing name for a monitor which supports HDR as well as FreeSync. The actual FreeSync part of FreeSync 2 most likely works exactly the same as before.

 

https://www.sweclockers.com/artikel/18798-intervju-amd-om-dynamiska-frekvenser-med-project-freesync/2#pagehead

"

Could you please explain the difference between AMD FreeSync and VESA Adaptive-Sync?

– VESA DisplayPort Adaptive-Sync is a new component of the DisplayPort 1.2a specification that allows a graphics card to control the refresh rate of a display over a DisplayPort link. As it seems there is some confusion, I want to emphasize that DisplayPort Adaptive-Sync is not FreeSync. By itself, DisplayPort Adaptive-Sync is a building block that provides a standard framework a source device, e.g. a graphics card, can depend on to execute dynamic refresh rates.

DisplayPort Adaptive-Sync is an important development in our industry, however, because there now exists an industry-standard framework that dynamic refresh rate technologies, like Project FreeSync, can rely on to deliver end-user benefits: no tearing, minimal input latency, smooth framerates, etc. Make no mistake, providing dynamic refresh rates to users still takes a lot of ‘secret sauce’ from the hardware and software ends of our products, including the correct display controllers in the hardware and the right algorithms in AMD Catalyst.

"

Also

https://www.amd.com/en/technologies/free-sync-faq

https://vesa.org/featured-articles/vesa-adds-adaptive-sync-to-popular-displayport-video-standard/

 

 

Basically adaptivesync is the free open standard owned by VESA which allows a display to have variable refresh rate.

Freesync is just the AMD implementation of hardware/software adaptivesync compatibility with their GPUs.

 

What nvidia is doing is making their own version of 'freesync', a software+hardware compatibility layer, which uses adaptivesync which is free.

[D13H4RD]

From what I've heard, FreeSync is built on top of VESA A-Sync.

 

Might not be exactly the same, but it does seem to use that sort of framework.

 

Which also helps explain why NVIDIA is also able to have it work on FreeSync monitors.

[Beowulff83]

8 hours ago, D13H4RD said:

automatically turn on GSync support for those monitors in its GeForce software.

So if you are not on the approved list you can manually turn it on?  I hope so.  If not i don't understand why they would exclude anyone, just don't officially support the cheaper monitors.