Microsoft to include Chromium in Windows 10 (Edge will use Chromium engine, which Chrome extention support)

[dalekphalm]

13 minutes ago, huilun02 said:

Yes, but

On top of script blockers and addons walling off tracking cookies and stopping analytics scripts. My pihole blocking a crapton of MS and Google connections at the IP and DNS level. The internet I surf is practically devoid of third party ads, and a lot of "free" phone apps outright break because they can't make the connection to send my data home or load ads.

I'm not sure what your point here was... Google is also an industry partner in the PRISM program. There is no "yes but", there's just "yes, both are doing it".

[ZacoAttaco]

2 minutes ago, huilun02 said:

You make it sound like I'm definitely using Chrome/Chromium...

Yeah I guess I implied that, because you mentioned your disdain Bing, so I guess you're not using Google search?

[dalekphalm]

2 minutes ago, huilun02 said:

You make it sound like I'm definitely using Chrome/Chromium...

No, but this is a thread about Edge being replaced with Chromium...

 

You said that MS was going to track your browsing history, and @ZacoAttaco responded that Google basically does the same thing.

 

Your reply, "Yes, but..." with the link to PRISM, doesn't make sense as a reply to that. You never mentioned any other browsers, so therefore the only logical assumption is that we were all still talking about Chromium/Chrome vs Edge.

 

Google, the subject matter of the quote you responded to, is also a PRISM partner. So therefore, yeah, just confusing reply without the context that you're using a different browser not previously mentioned in the thread.

[Johnny4990]

5 hours ago, Canada EH said:

I've never used either. People either love Chrome or just dont care for it.

 

https://www.computer-geek.net/what-are-the-advantages-a-va-49.html

 

Disadvantages:

• Chrome uses up a lot of memory (RAM) when running it.
• If you accidently close the browser, Chrome will close all the tabs opened without warning.

 

 

Mozilla Firefox is better, with DuckDuckGo as the search engine.

Anyone here tried VIVALDI? It's very impressive and privacy focused. I think the former team from Opera is behind it. 

[RejZoR]

The problem with Edge was never even a speed or security. Problem was usability. I can't use browser that has no real extensions or extensive features out of the box like Opera does. I also heavily depend on syncing for bookmarks. None of that was ever in IE or Edge.

[Granular]

On one hand, Yay for open source!

On the other, that's one fewer browser standing in the way of Google's expanding influence on web standards.

[mr moose]

5 hours ago, Nowak said:

You mean that Microsoft will actually ship a competent browser with their OS instead of a browser that's only good for downloading another browser?

No you must have misread the OP, MS are going to ship it with google crap instead.

 

It seems the biggest thing to kill MS products like this is developer support, no one wants to port their addons or apps to MS products.  In that type of environment it doesn't matter how good a product is, it will fail.

[RejZoR]

Now only black sheep is Firefox standing against Chromium dominance. Chrome, then it was Opera, Vivaldi and now Microsoft's browser, all using Chromium. I just hope Firefox won't ditch their thing as well. Firefox just needs to get their shit together with Add-ons syncing. It's totally utterly broken.

[ZacoAttaco]

Just now, RejZoR said:

The problem with Edge was never even a speed or security. Problem was usability. I can't use browser that has no real extensions or extensive features out of the box like Opera does. I also heavily depend on syncing for bookmarks. None of that was ever in IE or Edge.

Agreed, a browser without support for extensions is unusable for me. I'm probably too reliant on them to be honest.

 

[Nowak]

54 minutes ago, Johnny4990 said:

Anyone here tried VIVALDI? It's very impressive and privacy focused. I think the former team from Opera is behind it. 

It's my main browser and yes, the former Opera team is behind it.

 

6 minutes ago, mr moose said:

No you must have misread the OP, MS are going to ship it with google crap instead.

A custom browser based on the Chromium source, yes. But not directly something from Google.

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, Nowak said:

It's my main browser and yes, the former Opera team is behind it.

 

A custom browser based on the Chromium source, yes. But not directly something from Google.

I have yet to see any evidence that anything built on google open source anything is good (especially in regard to privacy and so on).

 

 

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

5 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

Oh I thought Chromium was just an early version of chrome.

no it isn't. it's an open-source browser google chrome is based on. google just takes it and slaps their tracking stuff on it. if you use chromium and chrome next to each other you wouldn't notice a difference. 

[LAwLz]

On one hand, I am glad that Microsoft are killing it off since Edge have been pretty shit ever since it was released, and has been in my opinion a colossal waste of time.

On the other hand, it's sad to see all that time and money go to waste, and we lose a potential driving force in the industry (more competitors and different approaches to a problem = better).

 

5 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

The web browser restarted from scratch with the code name Spartan as a replacement to IE

Edge was not rewritten from scratch. Not sure if that is what you are trying to say with this sentence, but I am sure that some people will interpreted it as such.

Edge was quite heavily based on Internet Explorer. Or more specifically, EdgeHTML (Edge's layout engine) is a fork of Trident (IE's layout engine). Here is a statement from Microsoft:

Quote

"The Spartan rendering engine (edgehtml.dll) is a new component and separate from Trident (mshtml.dll). The new engine began as a fork of Trident, but has since diverged rapidly over the past many months, similar to how several other browser engines have started as forks prior to diverging. The new rendering engine is also being built with a very different set of principles than Trident - for example: a focus on interoperability and the removal of document modes."

In fact, you can set Internet Explorer to use EdgeHTML if you want.

 

 

Side note: The Anandtech article mentions how Edge will use both Trident and EdgeHTML for compatibility reasons. This was later changed as explained in this article. That is to say, "Edge has both engines" is not the reason why IE and Edge share exploits. They share exploits because one is a fork of the other, and contains the same code.

 

Here are some examples of exploits shared by Internet Explorer and Edge. Just a small sample I could find

on Mitre's website.

 

 

 

6 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

Microsoft is already on its way in participating in the open source project on GitHub, helping the web browser have a native ARM64 version for, you guessed it, Windows 10 for ARM. This also means, if you really want to stick with Google web browser, that Google can, just release a Windows 10 on ARM ARM64 version as Google Chrome is Chromium the open project that they started. Google, pretty much just takes Chromium, slap its ecosystem and tracking and calls it a day (although Google does actively work on Chromium). 

"Google actively work on Chromium" is an understatement.

The Chromium project was standard by Google, is maintained by Google, and Google has probably written like 90% of it although I can't really prove that since there is no way of checking that doesn't involve hundreds of hours of manual labor.

 

 

 

5 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

I would seriously consider using it, assuming it had:

Chrome/Chromium extension support

Browser sync (bookmarks, extensions, passwords, etc) 

A pinnable bookmarks bar 

And bonus: integration with Office365/OneDrive, etc.

But at that point you have to ask, why use this browser instead of Chrome? Chrome already has the things you listed.

So does Firefox for that matter.

 

 

22 minutes ago, mr moose said:

No you must have misread the OP, MS are going to ship it with google crap instead.

 

It seems the biggest thing to kill MS products like this is developer support, no one wants to port their addons or apps to MS products.  In that type of environment it doesn't matter how good a product is, it will fail.

Edge did not die because of third party addon support. It died because it was constantly behind in terms of functionality, features and standard support.

[suicidalfranco]

FINALLY!

[LAwLz]

50 minutes ago, mr moose said:

I have yet to see any evidence that anything built on google open source anything is good (especially in regard to privacy and so on).

Kind of off-topic but...

• Chromium, and even if you don't agree with that V8 was revolutionary and the foundation of how future JS engines would be designed. (Web browser)
• Android (Operating system)
• AngularJS (JavaScript framework)
• Dart (programming language)
• A ton of contributions to GNU/Linux (both first hand as well as those ported from Android).
• VP8, VP9 and AV1 (video codecs)
• Google funded the development of Python (the lead designer was employed at Google for 7 years) (programming language)
• Polymer (at least some parts of it are good) (JavaScript library)
• TensorFlow (machine learning libraries)
• HTML5 (web standard)
• WebRTC (web standard)
• Brotli (compression algorithm)
• PDFium (PDF renderer)
• SPDY which later became HTTP/2 (web standard)
• AMP, although that is very debatable if it's actually good. (create mobile optimized webpages)

 

Just to mention a few from the top of my head.

 

[duncannah]

Yes, finally! As a front end web dev this makes me quite happy

[mr moose]

4 minutes ago, LAwLz said:

Kind of off-topic but...

• Chromium, and even if you don't agree with that V8 was revolutionary and the foundation of how future JS engines would be designed.
• Android
• AngularJS
• Dart
• A ton of contributions to GNU/Linux (both first hand as well as those ported from Android).
• VP8, VP9 and AV1
• Google funded the development of Python (the lead designer was employed at Google for 7 years).
• Polymer (at least some parts of it).
• TensorFlow
• HTML5
• WebRTC
• Brotli compression
• PDFium
• SPDY which later became HTTP/2
• AMP, although that is very debatable if it's actually good.

 

Just to mention a few from the top of my head.

 

Me thinks you missed the point.

[LAwLz]

1 minute ago, mr moose said:

Me thinks you missed the point.

Maybe I did. Can you elaborate on what your point was?

[mr moose]

Just now, LAwLz said:

Maybe I did. Can you elaborate on what your point was?

You linked to a lot of program languages and java stuff that maybe be partly developed by google but is also under the control of other entities. 

 

As we are talking about end user products (browsers and operating systems) and not tools for developing websites. So things like Android (which is argued by many to be a suck hole for personal data) sometimes lacks the ability for developers to be able to remove the shittier side of googles practices.  I can't imagine that using the foundation of chromium to create a new web browser is going to be any better than just using chrome browser.

[AlTech]

Oooof. I hope this means MS will allow apps to use CEF and the Chromium engine in the Windows Store going forward.

[AlTech]

12 minutes ago, mr moose said:

You linked to a lot of program languages and java stuff that maybe be partly developed by google but is also under the control of other entities. 

 

As we are talking about end user products (browsers and operating systems) and not tools for developing websites. So things like Android (which is argued by many to be a suck hole for personal data) sometimes lacks the ability for developers to be able to remove the shittier side of googles practices.  I can't imagine that using the foundation of chromium to create a new web browser is going to be any better than just using chrome browser.

Brave recently went this route of killing off their own old UI and going with Chromium front end mostly.

 

They were still able to differentiate it with their own customisations and offer better privacy than Chrome.

[Canada EH]

7 hours ago, DocSwag said:

3.5 gb vs 3.8

You pay more for Chrome in the end, its Google after all.

[Canada EH]

8 hours ago, dalekphalm said:

I would seriously consider using it

It is however still Google, they probably have a tracer on your mouse pointer to report back to HQ for quick sale of info. Billy of course would approve. Probably have some update "snags" that open up all security patches and just shrug the shoulders.

[yian88]

what the actual fuck MS?

make windows open source already you cunts, i cant stand it anymore, we have bear with MS experiments on windows and they refuse to admit they fail hard until years later after the dmg has been done

UWP is next, that garbage has to go, we need a new programming model and we need no telemetry

 

Let me guess GoodBytes will rage at me desperately trying to show great ms store is (not), and a couple years later when they admit store is a disaster and phase it out, then i will " I told you so" (again)....

[Ashley MLP Fangirl]

this is a very good thing. chromium is a really stable browser (i always use it on my Linux systems) so if MS don't screw it up too much injecting their telemetry and other bullcrap it might actually be a good browser. 

 

a good browser from MS, crazy i know.