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Kladmaster

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  1. Like
    Kladmaster got a reaction from CanCeralp in Jagged Shadows,Pop in,Low LOD and jagged aa   
    Ive been reading this topic for quite some time now, coming up with some ideas and watching how some people are going in circles, mixing apples with oranges here etc.
    I would like to just tell my opinion here.
    I work in company, where we test videogames. Obviously I cannot say which ones Anyway, I had dozens of gaming PCs, Xboxes, PS4s getting through my hands and I can assure you, ALL of them have AA issues, just like discussed here.
    SO
    Is HW at the fault here?
    NO its not. It is highly improbable that so many devices showcase the exact same level of graphical issue as discussed here. Only exception could be some specific artefacting of GPU or RAM, etc., however this is not connected to the general issue discussed.

    Is it electricity? 
    Again I am saying NO. Unless it is some worldwide virus spreading through the power grids everywhere... and yeah, that sounds frankly too stupid to be true. As I said bunch of times before, in my company, there is extra care put in proper power solutions to all the HW that is running around here. I doubt that in my home, at my friends homes, in my company that is a modern fancy IT building, would be the same sort of "dirty electricity" going on.
    Electricity or some sort of EMI could be a culprit, but I believe you would again see much different and more serious behaviour, that jaggies on fine geometry or that it would make your GPU too slow to render in objects/shadows into your game.
     
    In my point of view, its more like rooted deep in nowadays game engines, graphical drivers and API. Just like @CanCeralp nicely explained already: Modern games (mostly the Dx11 era) are running on much more complex game engines. The geometry in them is extremely complex, add complex light and shadowing effects with bunch of other crap in it, like subsurface scattering, particle effects and what not...add some filters, postprocessing and other effects... you are creating a nightmare for the GPU to render a single frame, yet alone 60+ in a second. I would also add the pixel responsiveness of current LCD display technology, various sharpness clearing, resolutions and their scaling, PPI and combine it and we got ourselves one huge mess. 
    When I am testing very early stages of game builds, their optimisation is frankly terrible, even if you are running one of the strongest HW you can get. And there are sometimes some commands we use, if our fps is tanking to 10-20fps, to optimise the engine to run smoother, but decreasing the quality greatly. While using those, you can immediately notice texture/shadow pop ins, general low quality of rendering, but the game runs stable fps. You can then switch to higher resolutions, adjust the graphic sliders to the highest, the base bad looks just stay. 
    So imagine, that developers are implementing such optimisation shortcuts into their games via patches, drivers... if they cannot achieve stable performance, that is mostly aimed for consoles/mid tier PCs. We can think of several few years old games, that if you crank them up to the top (GTA5, Crysis, AC...) not even the 1080ti (which was the absolute top in the days) could keep up and not drop below "acceptable" levels. Or think about the infamous Aliens: Colonial Marines, that ran the E3 demo on nearly a CGI movie level rendering, yet the final product was far from it (this is actually very true to many other trailers and marketing for gmes).  That might give you some thought to think about. 

    In my case... Well, I see those issues everywhere yes... all the gameplay or videos about games I watch on YT, I see the same bad AA in there, as I see it on my PC. 
    I decided not to waste more time trying to fix it, as it is probably impossible. Some games look worse, some better... but in general, if I adjust the sharpness filter to blur out the most horrid AA and while playing, mostly focus on the central part of the game and avoid looking "into distance", Ive learned to live it it. 
     
  2. Agree
    Kladmaster got a reaction from DaoNayt in Jagged Shadows,Pop in,Low LOD and jagged aa   
    Ive been reading this topic for quite some time now, coming up with some ideas and watching how some people are going in circles, mixing apples with oranges here etc.
    I would like to just tell my opinion here.
    I work in company, where we test videogames. Obviously I cannot say which ones Anyway, I had dozens of gaming PCs, Xboxes, PS4s getting through my hands and I can assure you, ALL of them have AA issues, just like discussed here.
    SO
    Is HW at the fault here?
    NO its not. It is highly improbable that so many devices showcase the exact same level of graphical issue as discussed here. Only exception could be some specific artefacting of GPU or RAM, etc., however this is not connected to the general issue discussed.

    Is it electricity? 
    Again I am saying NO. Unless it is some worldwide virus spreading through the power grids everywhere... and yeah, that sounds frankly too stupid to be true. As I said bunch of times before, in my company, there is extra care put in proper power solutions to all the HW that is running around here. I doubt that in my home, at my friends homes, in my company that is a modern fancy IT building, would be the same sort of "dirty electricity" going on.
    Electricity or some sort of EMI could be a culprit, but I believe you would again see much different and more serious behaviour, that jaggies on fine geometry or that it would make your GPU too slow to render in objects/shadows into your game.
     
    In my point of view, its more like rooted deep in nowadays game engines, graphical drivers and API. Just like @CanCeralp nicely explained already: Modern games (mostly the Dx11 era) are running on much more complex game engines. The geometry in them is extremely complex, add complex light and shadowing effects with bunch of other crap in it, like subsurface scattering, particle effects and what not...add some filters, postprocessing and other effects... you are creating a nightmare for the GPU to render a single frame, yet alone 60+ in a second. I would also add the pixel responsiveness of current LCD display technology, various sharpness clearing, resolutions and their scaling, PPI and combine it and we got ourselves one huge mess. 
    When I am testing very early stages of game builds, their optimisation is frankly terrible, even if you are running one of the strongest HW you can get. And there are sometimes some commands we use, if our fps is tanking to 10-20fps, to optimise the engine to run smoother, but decreasing the quality greatly. While using those, you can immediately notice texture/shadow pop ins, general low quality of rendering, but the game runs stable fps. You can then switch to higher resolutions, adjust the graphic sliders to the highest, the base bad looks just stay. 
    So imagine, that developers are implementing such optimisation shortcuts into their games via patches, drivers... if they cannot achieve stable performance, that is mostly aimed for consoles/mid tier PCs. We can think of several few years old games, that if you crank them up to the top (GTA5, Crysis, AC...) not even the 1080ti (which was the absolute top in the days) could keep up and not drop below "acceptable" levels. Or think about the infamous Aliens: Colonial Marines, that ran the E3 demo on nearly a CGI movie level rendering, yet the final product was far from it (this is actually very true to many other trailers and marketing for gmes).  That might give you some thought to think about. 

    In my case... Well, I see those issues everywhere yes... all the gameplay or videos about games I watch on YT, I see the same bad AA in there, as I see it on my PC. 
    I decided not to waste more time trying to fix it, as it is probably impossible. Some games look worse, some better... but in general, if I adjust the sharpness filter to blur out the most horrid AA and while playing, mostly focus on the central part of the game and avoid looking "into distance", Ive learned to live it it. 
     
  3. Funny
    Kladmaster got a reaction from Darker17 in Jagged Shadows,Pop in,Low LOD and jagged aa   
    Ive been reading this topic for quite some time now, coming up with some ideas and watching how some people are going in circles, mixing apples with oranges here etc.
    I would like to just tell my opinion here.
    I work in company, where we test videogames. Obviously I cannot say which ones Anyway, I had dozens of gaming PCs, Xboxes, PS4s getting through my hands and I can assure you, ALL of them have AA issues, just like discussed here.
    SO
    Is HW at the fault here?
    NO its not. It is highly improbable that so many devices showcase the exact same level of graphical issue as discussed here. Only exception could be some specific artefacting of GPU or RAM, etc., however this is not connected to the general issue discussed.

    Is it electricity? 
    Again I am saying NO. Unless it is some worldwide virus spreading through the power grids everywhere... and yeah, that sounds frankly too stupid to be true. As I said bunch of times before, in my company, there is extra care put in proper power solutions to all the HW that is running around here. I doubt that in my home, at my friends homes, in my company that is a modern fancy IT building, would be the same sort of "dirty electricity" going on.
    Electricity or some sort of EMI could be a culprit, but I believe you would again see much different and more serious behaviour, that jaggies on fine geometry or that it would make your GPU too slow to render in objects/shadows into your game.
     
    In my point of view, its more like rooted deep in nowadays game engines, graphical drivers and API. Just like @CanCeralp nicely explained already: Modern games (mostly the Dx11 era) are running on much more complex game engines. The geometry in them is extremely complex, add complex light and shadowing effects with bunch of other crap in it, like subsurface scattering, particle effects and what not...add some filters, postprocessing and other effects... you are creating a nightmare for the GPU to render a single frame, yet alone 60+ in a second. I would also add the pixel responsiveness of current LCD display technology, various sharpness clearing, resolutions and their scaling, PPI and combine it and we got ourselves one huge mess. 
    When I am testing very early stages of game builds, their optimisation is frankly terrible, even if you are running one of the strongest HW you can get. And there are sometimes some commands we use, if our fps is tanking to 10-20fps, to optimise the engine to run smoother, but decreasing the quality greatly. While using those, you can immediately notice texture/shadow pop ins, general low quality of rendering, but the game runs stable fps. You can then switch to higher resolutions, adjust the graphic sliders to the highest, the base bad looks just stay. 
    So imagine, that developers are implementing such optimisation shortcuts into their games via patches, drivers... if they cannot achieve stable performance, that is mostly aimed for consoles/mid tier PCs. We can think of several few years old games, that if you crank them up to the top (GTA5, Crysis, AC...) not even the 1080ti (which was the absolute top in the days) could keep up and not drop below "acceptable" levels. Or think about the infamous Aliens: Colonial Marines, that ran the E3 demo on nearly a CGI movie level rendering, yet the final product was far from it (this is actually very true to many other trailers and marketing for gmes).  That might give you some thought to think about. 

    In my case... Well, I see those issues everywhere yes... all the gameplay or videos about games I watch on YT, I see the same bad AA in there, as I see it on my PC. 
    I decided not to waste more time trying to fix it, as it is probably impossible. Some games look worse, some better... but in general, if I adjust the sharpness filter to blur out the most horrid AA and while playing, mostly focus on the central part of the game and avoid looking "into distance", Ive learned to live it it. 
     
  4. Agree
    Kladmaster got a reaction from LilStormi in Jagged Shadows,Pop in,Low LOD and jagged aa   
    And another idea...
     
    It seems, that people come to this forum, because they think they might have the same issue, but its just a similar issue, that has some different cause. All of this causes a lot of confusion among us. Fundamentaly, the issue might not have a single solution, since it might not be caused by the same problem.
     
    Some very bad jaggyness, can actually be cause by bad electricity and EM resonance. Though its a very rare case. And its probably due to cables/wires intereference.
    Also I dont know how to explain the problems with LOD and texture/shadow poping. Perhaps something busted in OS/Drivers/VRAM/North Bridge....
     
    So yeah, someone saying, that his issue is caused by electricity, or faulty HW, might be actually right. But yeah, posting it in a 100+ pages on a forum like this, is just making the confusion worse.
     
  5. Agree
    Kladmaster got a reaction from Harsh45 in Jagged Shadows,Pop in,Low LOD and jagged aa   
    Hi guys,
    I see more and more people are starting to see this crap in games. I can confirm, that I tested few more PCs at work and also Xbox One consoles and its becoming more and more prevalent. 
    I understand, that people seem to consider the Electricity as the common denominator for this issue, but for me, it simply does not make sense.
    I am not an expert of course, but I believe, that something wrong in the grid, or just unstable current would cause much more severe artefacts in games, if not straight crashes (like when you overclock/underclock your CPU too much) than such delicate shimmer and graining on AA and shadows, plus the whole texture/shadow popping. Another thing, as I tried different PCs on different power outlets at home and work (I work in sort of IT company, so they have to have good power structure here), the results are always exactly the same, not worse there, better elsewhere. This would mean, that at least half of the Warsaw`s power grid is affected. 
    Also people tried changing PSUs, using power stabilizers etc, seemingly to no avail. 
    What baffles me, is that its happening on a very specific graphical rendering tasks, like the edges of items (aliasing), reflections (shimmering, grainy look), shadows/textures popping (slow draw calls, memory loads)....as if some specific parts of GPU degraded and dont perform properly anymore.
     
    I dont wanna throw in more theories as to what can be the cause, like EMI, Chemtrails, 5G mobile network, using Faraday`s cage to shield your PC case, some mining virus, that lives and hides deep in BIOS....
     
    It would for sure be for the best, to create a database, with some baseline games, to show exactly our symptoms and compare our compononents, location, system we use.
    based on this, we could derive the most possible cause and most importantly, try showing it to major players like AMD, Intel, Nvidia or some enthusiasts, like LTT group or so...
     
    If anyone has the skills to make some online DB to be populated like that, I will gladly share all my info there... There is no point of making this thread longer and longer, unless someone will post a real solution  
     
     
  6. Agree
    Kladmaster got a reaction from DaoNayt in Jagged Shadows,Pop in,Low LOD and jagged aa   
    Also, it might be worth to set up some kind of a baseline for all of us to test and compare the issues in Case 1. 
     
    Something like google doc, where we could chose several games and add screenshots and best some videos of a specific area, where these problems appear.
    That way we all can be on the same page as to where and how those things are appearing. From this we can derive some statistics for the platforms, drivers, HW, OS, even in game/NVCP settings.
    And if we get this properly documented, send it all to Nvidia, AMD, Microsoft and demand answers.
     
    Since right now, I think many people are confused on what exactly we are pointing at and everyone is throwing just theories etc. Also, that way we can spread the awareness much further, and people who think they are not affected, suddenly will notice it or they can send a proof they are not - from which we can gather information to narrow down the cause.
     
    Anyone has some idea where and how can this be set up ? (I am just a very average internet user and have not much knowledge of nowadays cloud sharing options).
    @I_dont_know200 had a good idea with summing it up under one article and post it on reddit, but without good visual backup and comparisons, its gonna turn into one long ass giant thread again, or get overlooked...
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