AngryBeaver

I would get it out before using the laptop again. The screw is metal and that means there is a high possibility it can create a short killing your motherboard and other connected devices.

On 2/1/2021 at 1:23 PM, piratemonkey said:

If tariffs are in effect for imports from China, there's always the possibility as the companies pay the tariffs. I haven't heard of Canada putting tariffs on China tho. If America has them, and you buy from American stores, there is again the possibility. I doubt the increases would be much if at all

The increase is about 25%. The second card i purchased had the new tariff prices applied and it was almost $200 more. This was from a microcenter too so I know it is 100% the tariff cost being transferred to the consumer.

5 hours ago, Ghoelian said:

I have an Arctic Liquid Freezer II 280, with 3 intake front fans (Noctua NF-F12), 2 output on the top of the case (whatever fans came with the AIO), and one more Noctua on the back as output in a Corsair 4000D Airflow.

When stressing the Ryzen 5 5600X with Prime95, temps get up to the high-70's (Celcius). This is fine, no thermal throttling happening or anything, but I just feel like this is too high for the amount of cooling I have.

My question then is, are these temps expected, and if not, what could I do to fix it? I've already swapped out the thermal paste, was using the stuff that came with the AIO at first, put some Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut in there.

This is temps from p95 which is worst case scenario. Your temps when gaming for example are probably in the mid to high 50s. This is exactly where I would think temps should be on that cooler.

17 minutes ago, bilal.FN said:

do aio cooler really leak easily like when you move your pc around or accidently move or twist the pipe?

 

Aios shouldn't ever leak. Now that isn't to say there aren't bad units, but these units should be completely sealed.

If you by from a reputable brand they warranty the AIO and cover any damages in the event it leaks.

I'll drop this here. De8auer did a good video on it. Jay has another one on it and I think Linus even did one. All of the results are pretty much the same.

1 hour ago, GhostRoadieBL said:

 

This is what I'm looking to test, how low flow can a loop go before the component temps start to rise due to a lack of volume of fluid flowing through the system to take away the heat. 

giving the fluid more time in the block to take in more temperature (entropy transferred to the liquid) isn't a bad thing if there is still enough flow for the amount of watts of heat energy being exhausted by the components.

Faster fluid flow can provide a cooler volume of fluid into block until the thermal mass of the fluid in the loop is saturated, but eventually the loop will saturate regardless of how fast the fluid moves at which point the thermal transfer is at it's least efficient in the blocks but most efficient in the radiators. That's why the loop is saturated equal energy in and out causing no more change in temperature. 

 

so I think to be more clear; the fluid flow rate is the variable to test, volume of the loop is constant, after saturation the thermal transfer rate "should" be constant but is based on how fast the fluid transfers heat between the blocks and radiators which is based on flow rate of the fluid, thermal energy in and out are constants based on the power consumption of the CPU and the radiator's heat transfer to the air after loop saturation. 

 

I guess the filtered qustion becomes how over provisioned is the flow rate of a pump running at full vs running at lower rpms have the manufacturers made them? how low can you make a loop's flow rate before the block can't transfer heat fast enough and makes the components heat up and is max speed the best setting when it puts the most wear and tear on the pump?

this also effects air bubbles forming and moving in the system, as well as increased turbulence which causes erosion in components,

Yes the loop will eventually hit equilibrium. Though that comes down to water temp vs ambient, air flow, and surface area. 

30 minutes ago, GhostRoadieBL said:

what is the effect to the cooling performance of an AIO or Custom Loop's cooling effectiveness by having a PWM pump curve vs full duty cycle all the time? 

 

This will obviously effect liquid dwell time in the blocks and radiators so does a lower pump speed shorten the loop time to thermal saturation or can it cause a lower loop saturation temperature due to the more efficient transfer from block to liquid (more dwell time for heat transfer) and liquid to radiator (wider temperature difference and longer time in contact with fins)?

 

My theory is assuming;

- a consistent heat load source (ie CPU during benchmarking, not looking for "less CPU load puts less heat into the loop" answers)

- a fixed air temp entering the radiators (eliminating atmosphere variables, assume open bench temperature controlled space)

- not pushing the loop flow rate so low as to overwhelm the thermal capacity of the liquid in the blocks

 

I believe, by having the pump at full flow all the time the loop would be less efficient as heat transfer rates require some dwell time and running something like a D5 into a CPU and 240mm radiator at maximum flow rate is going to cause a higher saturation temperature (entropy left over in the liquid after the radiator) than lowering the flowrate to allow more efficient heat transfer from fluid to air by tuning the pump speed to less than full speed. 

 

I don't have a way to test this so I'm looking for someone willing to do a test or maybe has had this thought as well and found the solution to cure my curiosity. 

 

Higher flow reduces temp variance outside the loop. It does reduce the time water spends in the blocks/rads when you look at it over a time frame, but it does spend less time per trip.

Generally higher pumps speed (more flow) will bring better temps. Remember thermal transfer happens more efficiently as the sources get further apart in temps. So having a constant stream of cool water allows more heat to transfer as it is constantly replaced with fresh cool water.  When you slow down the fluid has more time to rise in the blocks which means it can absorb less total energy. So while the water leaving actually is hotter than a fast flow... the temps on the components goes up because of less thermal transfer.

52 minutes ago, Donut417 said:

According to Comcast, they got rid of their Bandwidth Management system. So I don't really think they are shaping traffic. They are just charging you a metric boat load if you go over the cap, that was their solution. Yeah, they could upgrade their infrastructure but some areas are already upgraded to Node +0. They still haven't figured out how to upgrade the upload side of the network. Which is the upgrades they need to do. 

No they just aren't willing to dedicate the channels for upstream... so now you have a gb plan that caps at 40mbps up.

13 minutes ago, cm992 said:

The 5600x is a much better choice than the 3600 in my opinion. Your motherboard already supports the 5600x with a bios update. The 5600x has much better single core performance which is the most important for gaming. Since you said Canadian I will refer to memoryexpress.com where the ryzen 3600 is $265 and in stock and the ryzen 5600x is $430 and out of stock. If you go with the 5600x you'll be getting the most out of your platform. However with the $165 price difference I can see how the 3600 is more appealing. One thing to note is that you'll be downgrading in a sense from an 8 core 1800x to a 6 core 3600 or 5600 but since you are just gaming the single core improvements will make up for that. Actually I think the 5600x passes the 1800x in multicore workloads just because the 6 cores it has are much faster. 

This is also a 3600 and not a 3600x vs a 5600x. I know the only different was base/boost speeds from the factory, but the 3600x was 50ish more than the 3600.

Also the 3600x out performs the 1800x in multi and single thread in most benchmarks.

The 5600x would murder it.

1 hour ago, Donut417 said:

Comcast used to have an bandwidth management system. They got rid of it saying it’s no longer necessary. However this was around the time they got in trouble for throttling BitTorrent traffic. So that might be the reason. 

They can still shape traffic. They just aren't doing it as aggressively as they were with bittorent.

I tried and Uninstalled valorant right away. I am a firm believer in the rule of least access. I don't believe a cheat engine needs kernel access to be effective. Sure it makes it harder, but there are still cheats and it just gives them more access into my machine than they have any right to.

More people should just shelf this game and play the many others that are pretty much identical.

On 1/31/2021 at 11:06 PM, Donut417 said:

Spectrum is under FCC restrictions for data caps. Basically they had to kiss the governments ass to get the merger thru. I don’t think they can cap till next year, no data cap is a selling point in Comcast, Cox and Mediacom areas because those companies cap. 
 

If they do cap they will probably off an unlimited plan like Comcast did. 

Data caps are such a huge step backwards. They have traffic shaping and the ability to keep a handful of power users from saturating their network which is already much harder with docsis 3.1. Just more greedy money grabbing for a service that is over 99% profit.

1 hour ago, CLEAR RTC said:

I'm not ruling out CPU bottlenecking but when you check online for CPU GPU performance in warzone 3770K's with 980Ti's are getting over 130 FPS average.  Hard to believe an Ivy Bridge is outperforming Pinnacle Ridge. Maybe the OP here and I have different issues but I am getting 10% less FPS than I did with my Vega 56.  I am not suggesting bad hardware but a software or configuration problem.  I may also have the opportunity to test my system with a 3800x which I will do on my existing Win10 install and the Fresh install.  I'll see about getting some proper logging done as well.

The 1st gen ryzen while a massive jump from the older bulldozer architecture was slower than most 2nd gen or higher Intel chips in both IPC and clock speeds.

That is why even an older cpu is pushing higher frames. Now the second gen chips closed the gap a little more, the 3rd gen again got much closer and then finally thr 5th gen took a clear IPC lead with boost breaking the 5ghz barrier on 1 or 2 cores.

So if you really want to shift your bottleneck to the gpu you should aim for a 3000 or 5000 series cpu. The 3000s are pretty cheap right now if money is the concern. You will also be able to play with the infinity fabric ratio to help get a little more performance even with 3200 ram.

1 hour ago, nelska said:

did not know that. I have always loved running my pc in the winter months in the attic because my idle temps on the cpu are somewhere between 19-25c and they top out at like 35c when gaming. Which is almost half as high as you would usually see.

OK. Would take that information with a grain of salt. The days where this was a big issue are mostly over. Yes it can happen, but in general the temps are much lower than you could get in an attic.

The biggest concern is like you said the freezing point of liquid. You should be able to look up the operating range of the aio to determine at what point it freezes. For the corsair line the magic number seems to be -20c (-4 f)

17 minutes ago, S1NN3T said:

@AngryBeaverI removed the side glass panel, but made no difference. GPU temp increased by 1 degree Celsius. CPU I didn't notice much difference either. Kept jumping around.

 

@freeagent Yes front 2x are intake. Rear 1x and top 1x are exhaust.

 

@LogicalDrmI didn't record temps before GPU upgrade. So no clue on that part. I felt the warmth under the desk after the GPU upgrade.

 

My plan was to install ANTEC Kuhler K240 on the front with stock cooler fans that come pre bundled. Install better fans for exhaust. I figured if I removed the cpu cooler block from the case, I would get cooler Ambience inside the case for GPU. Also since any air coming inside via the radiator will be cooler than what my Coolermaster H410r is spewing inside the case, it would help. Any thoughts. I am trying not to spend too much atm. Since waiting for a good used 2nd or 3rd  gen Ryzen and a brand new B450 motherboard. Both gonna cost me good money. And GPU I got less than a month ago. 

I wouldn't worry about doing anything atm. Your cpu and gpu temps are fine.

If you didn't see a decrease from removing the side panel then your case is getting proper flow.

So depending on how much noise you can take the next step would be to just adjust your gpu fan profile to be a little more aggressive. The coolers on most of them are able to reduce temps a good bit at 100%, but as said all of your temps are perfectly ok.

According to the specs. I would consider a 360mm in top or (if possible) a 280mm on the side. The surface area difference between a 360mm and 280mm is only about 10% depending on thickness.

So changing the gpu should not hurt your experience. Now with a gpu fast enough some games at 1080p could max out your cpu, but in general this would just keep your fps from hitting higher levels.

Now the new gpu could pull more juice which if your psu isn't up for the task could cause stability issues. There could be driver conflicts causing issues. You might even have something like a coin miner malware on your machine that with the extra gpu power is taxing yourself enough to cause issues.

I would first scan for malware. Then I would wipe graphics drivers and make sure all my drivers and windows updates were current. I would then do some digging in event viewer to look for any potential issues. I mean there are lots of variables, but outside of something being wrong with the gpu there shouldn't have been a decrease in performance.

On 1/30/2021 at 10:19 PM, SquiddyButler said:

Will my frames drop if I used a 3060 to with 1080p or will it not affect it

Personally at the difference in cost I would look more at a 3060ti which will offer much more performance for about 70 more. The 3060ti is anywhere from 30-60% faster than the 1080ti the other poster compared the 3060 with.

The 3080 does have a memory temp sensor due to it being common on gddr6x.

Now that said my 3080 can run at +1500 memory without errors when on water... my temps still hit 88c-90c. If I run my memory at +1000 then those temps are 80-84c. Which makes me a little nervous, but apparently anything under 95c is pretty safe. Now cards that are on air constantly throttle due to 110c or higher temps. 

Now I just need a water cooled backplate to help memory temps further.

Oh and since we are talking settings and hash rates. My 3080 runs at 68% plimit, -250 core, and since the difference isn't worth thr risk +1000 on memory for about 105 average MHs. At 1500 it will land around 110, but I would prefer seeing memory at 80-82c

3 hours ago, nayman898 said:

this is how bad the old tubing is, so cleaning this would be better than new tubing? Also, what is plasticizer? I don't remember reading about that when I did the build

 

Edit: all tubing and parts are EKWB, the tubing shouldn't have a plasticizer according to EKWB as of 2013. 

 

They all basically say they don't have it, but normally do have a small amount that leeches into the water. Looking at pics I would def replace the tubing and them run something like primochill system reboot for the full 48hrs to flush the sysytem.

10 minutes ago, shaz2sxy said:

but OP hasn't provided any evidence of this. from his posts it looks like they have posted other models for a higher price but not the one he ordered.

At a substantially higher price it sounds like. So them canceling orders and doing refunds is them trying to avoid a loss on an agreement they already made. If they have cards in stock then those should be offered at the price available 3 months ago... not the new inflated rates.

Anything else is a complete bait and switch scam.

"Here purchase now and we will send you the first available card!"

3 months later -

"Oops we are out of your card, but if you give us more money we will send you one we have in stock at the brand new inflated rate!"

They formed a binding agreement to fulfill his order. If they cannot get that card then an equivalent card should be provided. Since this happened 3 months ago it should be for the same series of card that was close to the same price at that time. 

What the OP should do is email and call them daily. The squeaky wheel gets the oil after all.

21 minutes ago, nayman898 said:

Thanks, I'll scrub the blocks and stuff down, tubing is cheap enough that I'll just replace it and save the headache. Just ordered some regular clear, hopefully this will work out better

New tubing means new plasticizer to build up again lol.

More than likely it was an issue with the loop not being cleaned and dried from your last coolant which caused issues with your new coolant.

These coolants are very sensitive to any other contaminants.

On 1/27/2021 at 5:32 PM, swangotango said:

I'll just insulate it. Or worst case put this on it https://www.omega.com/en-us/industrial-heaters/surface-heaters/flexible-heaters/srfra-srfga/p/SRFGA-104-5?gclid=CjwKCAiAu8SABhAxEiwAsodSZHIlhESvfaZlw5u6-fEfef7kUJSWYrsnh8py0R9A9vHt1r0gwzVkgRoCULcQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

 

You guys don't seem very solution oriented. Obviously this all can work and it can work with some diligent napkin math. It's not rocket science. 

It isn't that it can't be done. It is the upkeep and risk vs reward that make it an issue. 

My solution and a project I was doing but decided to give up on was very similar to this one... except I was going to use something like a raspberry pi to constantly monitor water temps and ambient temp/humidity to keep temps below ambient, but also above the dew point.

In the end it would need to occupy a closet or other remote space due to the noise level. Then it would be terrible in terms of cost effectiveness and lastly each loop would need to be changed as to not waste the energy used to keep lower temps.

My project was going to be for 4-5 computers, but having to pull radiators and losing the ability to easily use the computers elsewhere just didn't feel worth it. 

On 1/30/2021 at 10:21 PM, ImNotNeko said:

I assumed that this was a calcium build up and today I tried vinegar and bleach but neither were successful.

 

Anyone know how to clean this?

 

What do you even call this?

 

I'm referring to the line at the top of the reservoir.

That's where the coolant was topped off to.

 

I am using Corsair coolant (clear) with mainly corsair parts with a few EK parts.

Only copper/nickel.

I haven't found a way to disassemble the res enough to clean it. Mine has the same line, but mine is mostly from plasterizer from new soft tubing. It is damn near impossible to clean lol.