I think I would be really neat and kind of fun to be able to have our FAH activity listed on our profile, maybe somewhere near where the badges are. This display could be enabled in the profile settings if a particular person wanted to share their information. I think it would be a fun way for people who like to fold to stay motivated.
https://stats.foldingathome.org/api
I'm told this would probably be up to IP Board but I thought I would throw this out there anyway.
I think I would be really neat and kind of fun to be able to have our FAH activity listed on our profile, maybe somewhere near where the badges are. This display could be enabled in the profile settings if a particular person wanted to share their information. I think it would be a fun way for people who like to fold to stay motivated.
https://stats.foldingathome.org/api
I'm told this would probably be up to IP Board but I thought I would throw this out there anyway.
He can go with anything from an X5675 on up pretty easily, thus why I said X56xx Xeons, not specifically the X5680. And if he does decide to get a dual socket board, IIRC dual X5690s will beat my 4.2GHz R7 2700X in multicore, @WhisperingKnickers has a pair, IIRC he hasn't OCed them much yet (he has the godly SR-2, not a normal server board, so he can OC them if he wants).
1. Building a PC is the same, all the basic components are built to the standard ATX and such form factors
2. SSDs are super affordable now, highly reccomend them
3. AMD is killing Intel on the CPU side, the new Ryzen chips are amazing.
That should be most of what you'd need to know if you haven't kept up with anything since '08.
Hi, there is this company called "linus media group" which makes video ads for other companies.
Maybe you should check it out.
http://www.linusmediagroup.com/
I agree that it is a shame that they don't have any new news for the mac pro and then on top of that not having a dgpu option for the mac mini. Though I suppose it might be possible to plug in an external gpu (red team of course). Though with an external gpu it might ruin the minimalist feel.
(Tldr; Read the Conclusion and check Results for images & graphs)
Is 8GB of RAM sufficient for modern gaming?
Methodology
Run a mixture of in-game benchmarks and real gameplay.
Using FRAPS capture the Frametime data and plot the data on a graph using FRAFS comparing 8GB results to 16GB results. To use FRAPS to capture game Frametime Data you must go to the FPS tab within FRAPS and enable a hotkey for the benchmark tool. Set a timer for how long you want the benchmark tool to run. When the in-game benchmark begins, press the hotkey button to begin FRAPS data logging. Collected DATA is then exported and graphed using FRAFS.
Frametime data chosen as the primary metric of comparison as Average/Min/Max FPS data can fail to accurately reflect things such as microstutters that can be a result of memory issues.
Complete tests with minimal processes running in the background (closing all unnecessary background programs). The aim is to see the "Best case" scenario of what can be achieved with 8GB vs 16GB.
Completing additional tests with heavy memory load from background tasks - Achieved by opening chrome tabs in the background with up to 3GB of RAM usage for Chrome (clearly marked in results). The intention of these additional tests are to simulate results if people have programs opened in the background while they are gaming.
Pagefile is assigned to use the SSD (Samsung 840 Evo) when required.
What is being tested
RAM Capacity - The difference between 8GB of RAM (1x8GB) and 16GB of RAM (2x8GB)
What is NOT being tested
RAM Speed (frequency, latency, timings, etc)
Dual Channel memory (ie. 2x4GB vs 1x8GB)
Different game settings (all the same settings were used for all tests)
Anything else
Games Tested
Deus Ex Mankind Divided (DX11 and DX12 modes) - 2560x1440 Very High Preset, 2x MSAA
Grand Theft Auto V "GTA V" - 2560x1440 Very High* settings (*See attached benchmark.txt files in additional notes for full graphical settings)
Tomb Raider (2013) - 2560x1440 Ultimate preset
Just Cause 3 - 2560x1440 Very High preset, Antistropicx16, SMAA_T2X, Motion blur off
Metro Last Light Redux - 2560x1440 High Quality, SSAA On, Texture Filtering AF 4X, Motion Blur OFF, Tesselation High, Vsync Off, Advanced Phsyx On, Scene 1
Middle Earth: Shadow of Mordor - 2560x1440 Very High preset, tesselation on
PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds "PUBG" - High preset {View Distance: Ultra}
The games were chosen due to their demanding nature on systems, mixture of game engines, popularity, availability of built in benchmarks, and by special request. Where possible, in-game benchmarks were used to ensure consistency between runs. Some actual gameplay results were also used.
Results
Deus Ex Mankind Divided (DX11)
In Deus Ex Mankind Divided (DX11 mode) there are only minor differences between 8GB and 16GB of RAM, with 16GB of RAM performing marginally better and achieving a slightly better FPS. Consistency is roughly equal between the two tests, and there are no noteworthy FPS drops or microstutters. Gameplay experience should not be severely affected, though there were minor improvements (few average FPS) seen when changing from single channel 8GB to dual channel 16GB RAM configuration. This may be a result of the change to using dual channel memory providing performance boosts, and it's possible that similar benefits could be seen when running 2x4GB (8GB) in dual channel memory configuration, although this scenario was not tested.
(Note: Ignore the spike and subsequent drop in the 8GB (orange) results at the end of the graph - This is a result of capturing data as the test concluded and should be discarded.)
Deus Ex Mankind Divided (DX12)
In Deus Ex Mankind Divided (DX11 mode) we see an interesting result where the results for each test slowly go out of sync of each other. The pattern seen in the graphs is a result of what images are being rendered on screen during the benchmark, and for one to go out of sync with the other indicates that one test is able to get to each section in the test earlier - ie, it is running the benchmark faster. This also could be due to an error in logging of data, however test was repeated and similar pattern formed again. This is something we will see repeated in another test later... I have absolutely no idea why it did this in DX12 mode test but not in the DX11 test. If anyone has any thoughts, please share them. (I may end up repeating the tests again another day to rule out any errors in testing/graphing)
No noteworthy FPS drops or stutters to speak of, and results are fairly consistent again between 8GB and 16GB of RAM.
Gameplay experience on either systems will be comparable and perfectly enjoyable.
(Note: Disregard the spike and subsequent drop at the end of this graph for the 16GB test. This is a result of capturing data after the test was concluded and loading the results screen.)
Metro Last Light Redux
Metro Last Light was one of the tests that was extremely heavy on CPU and GPU, but in comparison relatively light on memory. Throughout benchmarking the benchmark didn't consume more than 2GB of system memory, meaning that at no time did the system need to rely on using pagefile. As a result, the two results between each test are near identical. There are quite a few small spikes throughout both tests, but appearing equally in both tests and often in the same areas. This could be an issue with the benchmark itself, or an issue caused on other hardware (CPU/GPU).
Gameplay experience with either 8GB or 16GB of RAM will be enjoyable
Middle Earth: Shadow of Mordor
This is one of our best results so far. We see a very consistent line between both tests with little variance. It also mostly stays below 8MS (above 125FPS+) which is a good result for the high resolution and graphical settings used. There are some small spikes on the 16GB of RAM test during the middle of the benchmark that are unexplained. These spikes may cause a noticeable stutter, however they are infrequent, possibly anomalies, so it's likely they won't be noticeable by the player or affect the gameplay experience. An extremely good gameplay experience can be had with either 8GB or 16GB of RAM.
(Note: The small higher grouping at the start, and the higher grouping at the end of the graph are recorded outside of the benchmark where a menu FPS limit is set - Disregard these sections)
Tomb Raider
Another fantastic result! Even better than the last. This is what a good Frametime graph should look like. Very consistent, little variance, absolutely no spikes, and a really low frametime (high FPS).
With either 8GB or 16GB you can expect an extremely smooth and enjoyable gameplay experience.
PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds (PUBG)
PUBG is infamous for being poorly optimised. Compared to the Tomb Raider result above, it's obvious how it earned that reputation. This graph is a good example of a poor experience captured in Frametime data. There are many, many spikes in frametimes - resulting in microstutters noticeable to the player. There are also large chunks where framerate (FPS) drops. This is likely due to events happening within the game, such as explosions or being closer to other players, however it could also be caused by other factors including memory if it's struggling to load data properly.
This is captured gameplay ("Training Ground") data, and will naturally not be as consistent as the previous tests which used in-game benchmarks that can give repeatable results. As a result, it's hard to make any conclusions from the data. The 8GB test does seem to have a larger spread with less consistency, however the whole graph is such a mess that it's hard to make any solid conclusions between the two.
It is worth noting that system memory usage was high during this test, nearing the estimated ~7.5GB limit for 8GB of RAM before the system starts relying on pagefile. Due to this, it's extremely likely that issues will be worsened if you have background apps like browsers or music players open. My recommendation would be to aim for 16GB of RAM, however you're likely to have a choppy experience regardless of how much RAM you have.
Just Cause 3
Here we start to see more definitive impact that system memory has while gaming. This data is recorded during actual gameplay, as Just Cause 3 lacks a built in benchmark tool. To Just Cause's credit, if you launch the game with only 8GB RAM the system will provide a notice stating that you may experience some issues with lower system memory, and recommends closing background programs to improve gaming performance.
You can clearly see the 16GB test was able to maintain a lower frametime (higher FPS). There's also noticeable areas in the middle of 8GB test where there were periods of FPS drops for a few seconds - it's possible this is a result of reading from the pagefile and slowing as a result.
Since there's noticeable improvements to FPS and to smoothness, I would recommend 16GB system for playing Just Cause 3, though you can still have an okay experience with 8GB as long as you don't mind lower average FPS, the occasional stutters or FPS drops.
There were even some periods of high spikes, indicating very noticeable stutters in the game that were noticeable during gaming. To get a better look at how high some of those stutters were, we can increase the scale for the graph to from max 30ms to max 100ms. There are several noticeable spikes around 50ms, and even a spike higher than 100ms towards the start of the test - something that would be extremely noticeable to the player.
Since the game recommends you to close background programs for a better experience, I decided to test if having additional memory in use by background applications would worsen the situation.
It wasn't as bad as I expected it to be, but there are more noticeable chunks of FPS drops that were present in the previous 8GB test.
Grand Theft Auto V
This is the test I was most interested in seeing. "Stutters in GTA V" is one of the more common threads I see here, often caused by insufficient memory. So I was curious to see for myself how it performs in a system with only 8GB of RAM.
I was actually surprised by these benchmark results - in that the 8GB tests were a lot better than I was expecting them to be.
It was very interesting to see that the graphs went out of sync during this test, like we saw in the Deus Ex Mankind Divided DX12 test. In the case of GTA V, I believe it was a direct cause of the way the GTA V benchmark runs. There are 5 scenes which are benchmarked, with loading screens between each test. The system with 16GB of memory spent less time in the loading screen between tests, so was able to start each test earlier. As the tests went on and went through more and more loading screens, the difference between the two systems becomes more pronounced. From this result we can expect that having 16GB over 8GB will give a noticeable improvement in loading times in GTA V (which are pretty horrible, so any benefit that can be had we should take! Note: The game is installed on an SSD)
It's a little bit harder to see due to the graphs being out of sync, however the 16GB test did perform noticeably better than the 8GB test. In some scenes there was a difference of up to 10FPS between the two tests (see Average FPS result graph further below)
(Note: The flat bars across the bottom are loading screens inbetween each benchmark test scene. Loading times are shorter on the 16GB system.
The results from the first benchmark didn't show as significant performance issues with 8GB as what I had expected. I decided to load up a bunch of Chrome tabs again and put more stress on the system memory and run the test again, to see if that could impact performance further...
There was a further drop, with an average of up to 20FPS difference between the 16GB system and the 8GB system with background processes hogging memory. The loading screens were significantly longer with this test as well with the graphs falling even further out of sync.
From this we can conclude the less background processes you have running, the better your experience should be.
Due to the nature of the GTA V benchmark with it running a series of short benchmarks, and then having a loading screen before the next test started, I was curious to see if actual gameplay would put additional load on the system as you remain in its open world for a longer period of time. I fired up Single Player mode and played for 5 minutes performing similar actions in each run, following a set path (Michaels house > Beach) and back and performing a variety of typical player actions such as driving, running, shooting, crashing my car many times, etc.
Here we see again the 16GB system performing significantly better than the 8GB system. We see approximately a 10-15FPS benefit from the 16GB system in actual gameplay. It should be noted that Task Manager was showing 97% memory usage and the system was definitely relying on page file during the 8GB test.
Again I tested with some background processes running, to simulate more of a 'worst case scenario' of someone having social media and a twitch video or youtube video playing music playing in the background while they play requiring additional memory from the system...
We see further performance loss here, similar to our earlier benchmark results.
I have also included the FPS results from the benchmark test. Included is the Minimum, Maximum, and Average FPS from each scene in the test, as well as the total average for the full benchmark test. The 16GB system performs consistently better than the 8GB system and the 8GB Stressed (with background programs running) system. In this graph the Average FPS is the best indicator of performance, as Max FPS and Min FPS can be effected by outliers. We can see a 10-15FPS drop
Conclusion
The results surprised me significantly. I went in to this fully expecting that most of these games would struggle significantly with only 8GB of RAM, however this was not the case.
Many of the games ran surprisingly well with only 8GB of RAM, with Tomb Raider, Middle Earth: Shadow of the Tomb Raider, Metro Last Light seeing no noticeable performance loss whatsoever. Deus Ex Mankind Divided saw minor performance loss in both DX11 and DX12 modes, however as long as background tasks are kept to a minimum there should be no noticeable loss in performance or smoothness in game.
PUBG shown what an absolute dog it is, and was equally bad in both 8GB and 16GB tests - Though my recommendation would still be 16GB for this game as I believe I was under a "best case scenario" where it was just able to copy with the RAM without needing to rely on the pagefile for system memory - Your experience may vary.
Just Cause 3 and GTA V showed more significant performance drops as a result of the memory, especially when background programs were running such as open browser tabs.
If you're building a gaming PC on a budget, then for the most part 8GB will be okay to start with, though you should still plan to upgrade to 16GB further down the line as there are games that will see benefit from the additional RAM.
If you're playing games like GTA V and Just Cause 3 with a system with only 8GB of RAM and are unable to upgrade to 16GB, my recommendation is close as many background processes as you can while you are playing, and try to disable as much useless programs from running at startup as possible in order to free up as much system memory as possible.
Additional Information
GTA V Benchmark Results: (Contains full graphical settings data) 8GB Benchmark-18-10-26-14-17-34.txt 8GB Stressed Benchmark-18-10-26-16-45-14.txt
16GB Benchmark-18-10-26-13-44-19.txt
Unless otherwise stated, the graphs used in the results section have their scale set from 0ms to a maximum of 30ms. This demonstrates the results with the best accuracy and ensures all results can be easily compared. Any frametimes measured beyond the 30ms point will simply hit the top of the chart. In some cases charts with a scale of 0ms to a maximum of 100ms were used to better demonstrate larger frametime spikes (stutters) - these graphs are noted as "(100ms max)".
Why did you choose 1x8GB instead of 2x4GB? You won't get dual channel!
I chose to use 1x8GB instead of 2x4GB for two main reasons.
I often see recommendations in budget build threads of people recommending to start out with 8GB of RAM, typically a 1x8GB stick, to keep the initial build cost down and then adding another 8GB later on. I wanted to test the viability of this plan.
I don't have any 4GB DDR4 sticks
From what I've seen in some of the games that weren't running out of memory, such as Tomb Raider and Middle Earth: Shadow of Mordor, the final results between 8GB (1x8GB) and 16GB (2x8GB) ended up being extremely close, almost indistinguishable. So it appears any performance loss from using single channel memory will be minimal in gaming tasks.
How do I interpret all those graphs? What do they all mean?
"LOWER IS BETTER, BUT CONSISTENCY IS EVEN BETTER STILL" - Steve, Gamers Nexus
Frametime is measured in milliseconds and is the time in between each frame. For 60FPS, there is 16.67ms between each frame. For 144FPS, there is 6.95ms between each frame.
When it comes to Frametime; LOWER IS BETTER. However, CONSISTENCY is also extremely important. Ideally the graph should display a low Frametime as well as a consistent line with as little deviation as possible. If a graph shows large spikes in frametime, this can be an indication of stutter. Some small spikes may not be noticeable, however larger spikes can cause a noticeable stutter in game which appears as if the game 'freezes' for a fraction of a second.
Below is an example of a GOOD frametime graph. Note the tight grouping of data and consistent nature. Very little variance, and the vast majority of the frametime is measured at below 8ms (125FPS). There are no frametime spikes indicating stutters or groupings of frametime spikes indicating framerate drops (low FPS).
Below is an example of a BAD frametime graph - Note the inconsistent nature with how the graph is more spread out indicating less consistency in FPS, as well as areas where there are large groupings of spikes marked red - resulting in noticeable framerate drops (lower FPS). Also note the single points marked green where the frametime peaks quite high which can be an indicator of a short stutter in game.
Note, the area marked in red with groupings of higher frametimes are often the result of whatever is happening in the game at the time, such as, for example, when large explosions take place that result in a small FPS drop while the game is displaying the explosion on screen and performing the physics calculations.
So, bad Frametime is caused by insufficient memory?
NO! Frametime is determined by your entire system, including the CPU and Graphics card. If we were comparing a weaker graphics card against a stronger graphics card, we would expect the weaker graphics card to have consistently higher frametimes than the stronger card.
It's important to use Frametimes to detect issues such as microstutters, as single frames that take longer to render and display may not be accurately reflected in average FPS calculations. Since the only variable we are changing is the RAM capacity used, with all the other hardware such as CPU and GPU remaining the same, we can deduce that any changes between the two results (8GB vs 16GB) are a result of the change in memory.
Limitations & Errors in Testing
In-game benchmarks used for most tests - May not accurately reflect real gameplay
When actual gameplay was used, there is natural variance in RAM usage and system demand based on what tasks are happening within the game.
Memory in 8GB configuration was not running in Dual Channel mode, which may give a slight advantage to the 16GB (2x8GB) configuration which was running in Dual Channel mode.
Limited games tested. - I can only test what games I own.
"My favourite game XYZ wasn't tested, it uses heaps of memory!!!!" - I can only test what games I own. If you would like me to test a specific game then please feel free to request it, however I cannot guarantee I will be able to test it.
This is the first time that I've focused on Frametime (ms) as the primary metric for benchmarking, and there may be some inconsistencies in reporting
RAM Usage & Pagefile Usage wasn't logged - I would have loved to be able to log the RAM/Pagefile usage alongside the Frametime data, however I'm not aware of a way to accurately log such information in a way that can be imported in to the Frametime Graph.
Only 2560x1440 resolution, and higher graphical settings were used. Different resolutions, such as 1080p or 4k, as well as different graphical settings may impact results.
"The bottom axis is sometimes wrong or has the numbers doubled up! FAKE NEWS!" - This is a result of the way FRAFS graphs its data. The axis is labelled with the FRAMES processed instead of DURATION (seconds) of the test.
Often benchmarks are set to run for a certain run, and if one test is running faster than the other then the faster test will complete more frames. (For example, 1 test running at 60fps for a minute will run 3600 frames. Another test running at a much faster 120FPS will complete 7200 frames in the same time. This means that the scale labelling frames at the bottom might not be synced between each test, however the time each test ran for was consistent)
The two result graphs were overlayed over the top of each other to obtain the final comparison graphs you see here, as a result some of the frames labelled at the bottom of the scales do not align. Unfortunately there's no way to label the axis with the TIME (duration) of the test, which would remain consistent between each run. Ultimately my advice is to ignore the labels on that bottom axis. (I couldn't be bothered removing them).
Extra stress on memory was achieved by opening tabs in Chrome during some tests (clearly noted which). This may have put additional stress on the CPU as well, which may have affected the results. These results are only provided in addition to the other results and do not replace them.
If you notice any other errors, please comment below and I'll review them and add them to this list.
So it appears that the most popular game console motion controllers where proto-types for the Game Cube.
So the it would have been a gamecube add-on if they where to release it back then.
https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/10/japanese-auction-reveals-nintendos-first-wii-remote-for-the-gamecube/
Okay x58 people. As far as I know I am the only active user using the SR2 but I have seen that some of you have been considering one.
If any of you do get one you should know that I am looking to sell my custom copper waterblocks for the chipset and vrm. They were milled specifically for this board. If any of you are interested feel free to HMU. It isn't like there is a big market for these so they probably wont be going anywhere anytime soon.
And Fiji at launch. And Hawaii immediately after launch. And Polaris/hawaii/vega during their respective mining crazes.
Also people seem to have forgiven AMD for launching the 390(x) at 50 dollar higher prices than the 290(x) variants were selling for at the time even though bios flashes on 8GB cards rendered their performance literally identical. So at that launch (very similar to RTX in some ways) AMD offered less value to users than was available before the launch.
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