What is really needed for 4k?

[MiniNinja6]

We have a 4k "smart" TV, but the "smart" features are very slow and lacking. My first thought was a chromecast, but that can't do 4k and not everyone in the family has android devices. So I'm thinking of a basic htpc. I want to spend as little as possible, it needs to be at least a micro atx case to fit in our media center, and I plan on using a wireless keyboard/trackpad combo thing that I already have. I don't need anything to beefy (hardware wise) to display in 4k right? All I want to do is stream media from things like Netflix and Youtube and play discs (I have a really nice usb 3 bluray player to go with it), no gaming or anything like that, so I should be able to use the built in graphics from a somewhat decent processor correct? I don't need help choosing a motherboard and ram and stuff, I just want to know if I can use a cheap cpu for graphics (amd apu or i3) or if I need discrete graphics or beefier hardware for this.

[afyeung]

4k gaming- 980ti SLI or Fury X crossfire for enjoyable framerates at Ultra settings in the latest games

4k- media- any gpu that has 4k capable video outputs

[The_Stig]

location?

[MiniNinja6]

4k gaming- 980ti SLI or Fury X crossfire for enjoyable framerates at Ultra settings in the latest games

4k- media- any gpu that has 4k capable video outputs

 

But does it have to be a gpu or are current generation built in graphics capable of it?

 

location?

 

California, but why does it matter?

[The_Stig]

But does it have to be a gpu or are current generation built in graphics capable of it?

 

 

California, but why does it matter?

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

 

CPU: Intel Pentium G3220 3.0GHz Dual-Core Processor  ($42.50 @ SuperBiiz) 

Motherboard: ASRock H81M-ITX/WIFI Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard  ($54.40 @ SuperBiiz) 

Memory: Crucial 4GB (1 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory  ($17.42 @ SuperBiiz) 

Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 320GB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  ($22.90 @ Amazon) 

Video Card: Sapphire Radeon R7 250 1GB Eyefinity Edition Video Card  ($73.95 @ SuperBiiz) 

Case: Antec ISK600 Mini ITX Tower Case  ($41.65 @ SuperBiiz) 

Power Supply: Corsair Builder 430W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply  ($33.99 @ Newegg) 

Total: $286.81

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-11-27 13:19 EST-0500

 

Cheap, the GPU supports 4k@60hz, small.etc

[TymmVonD]

You need HDMI 2.0 output from a GPU or a displayport input on your UHDTV. I just did a few searches and found very little as far as HDMI 2.0 motherboards. I know the 970 and up has 2.0(I have a 970 in my media PC on a Samsung UHDTV), but I found that possibly the 960 does as well.

[MiniNinja6]

 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

 

CPU: Intel Pentium G3220 3.0GHz Dual-Core Processor  ($42.50 @ SuperBiiz) 

Motherboard: ASRock H81M-ITX/WIFI Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard  ($54.40 @ SuperBiiz) 

Memory: Crucial 4GB (1 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory  ($17.42 @ SuperBiiz) 

Storage: Western Digital Caviar Blue 320GB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive  ($22.90 @ Amazon) 

Video Card: Sapphire Radeon R7 250 1GB Eyefinity Edition Video Card  ($73.95 @ SuperBiiz) 

Case: Antec ISK600 Mini ITX Tower Case  ($41.65 @ SuperBiiz) 

Power Supply: Corsair Builder 430W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply  ($33.99 @ Newegg) 

Total: $286.81

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-11-27 13:19 EST-0500

 

Cheap, the GPU supports 4k@60hz, small.etc

 

Thank you, that's exactly the price point I was looking at without a discrete gpu. 

 

Also, I don't have a lot of experience with Linux but considering all I need is a java/html capable web browser and a program to play mp4s and DVDs, a free Linux build seems like the way to go. But, can they scale to 4k? (I have almost no experience so sorry for the maybe stupid question)

[MiniNinja6]

You need HDMI 2.0 output from a GPU or a displayport input on your UHDTV. I just did a few searches and found very little as far as HDMI 2.0 motherboards. I know the 970 and up has 2.0(I have a 970 in my media PC on a Samsung UHDTV), but I found that possibly the 960 does as well.

 

Whats wrong with HDMI 1.4? It can display 4k at 30Hz right? It's just absolutely ridiculous to spend over $300 on a gpu just to display a youtube video! I don't even think our TV can go up to 60Hz

[TymmVonD]

Thank you, that's exactly the price point I was looking at without a discrete gpu. 

 

Also, I don't have a lot of experience with Linux but considering all I need is a java/html capable web browser and a program to play mp4s and DVDs, a free Linux build seems like the way to go. But, can they scale to 4k? (I have almost no experience so sorry for the maybe stupid question)

GTX 950 is the cheapest option for HDMI 2.0. No motherboards have it. That R7 card will limit you to 30Hz. 

[afyeung]

Whats wrong with HDMI 1.4? It can display 4k at 30Hz right? It's just absolutely ridiculous to spend over $300 on a gpu just to display a youtube video! 

Integrated graphics is fine too. Basically every gpu or cpu with integrated graphics now a days can display 4k 30hz at least. You definitely don't need a $300 gpu

[TymmVonD]

Whats wrong with HDMI 1.4? It can display 4k at 30Hz right? It's just absolutely ridiculous to spend over $300 on a gpu just to display a youtube video! 

The desktop feels horrible at 30Hz. Even consoles interface is at 60. I had my old rig on my UHD. The other thing, which may only be a problem I have, is our home videos are 60fps. And like you said, alot of youtube videos. The only way it was acceptable was to turn on smooth motion on the TV, but the mouse and typing delay was aggravating. Maybe I'm just spoiled. If the 950 was an option when I built mine, I would've gone that route. Apart from nvidia GPUS, there's nothing else that ouptuts 4K/60. Unless the TV has DP.

[TymmVonD]

Integrated graphics is fine too. Basically every gpu or cpu with integrated graphics now a days can display 4k 30hz at least. You definitely don't need a $300 gpu

GTX 950 is $120. It'll even play a handful of family games and lots of indies(bonus). Though, you could stream to your HTPC or just get a Wii U for living room gaming.

[MiniNinja6]

The desktop feels horrible at 30Hz. Even consoles interface is at 60. I had my old rig on my UHD. The other thing, which may only be a problem I have, is our home videos are 60fps. And like you said, alot of youtube videos. The only way it was acceptable was to turn on smooth motion on the TV, but the mouse and typing delay was aggravating. Maybe I'm just spoiled. If the 950 was an option when I built mine, I would've gone that route. Apart from nvidia GPUS, there's nothing else that ouptuts 4K/60. Unless the TV has DP.

 

Have you ever been to a movie theater? That movie was in 24fps. Standard HD TV from a satelite or cable provider is only 25fps. You would need a bionic eye to notice a delay caused by 30fps. Input lag has nothing to do with the refresh rate or frame rate of the display, and even if it did I'm not paying $500 for a GPU and PSU that can power it just to have a less laggy cursor, that;s just absolute bullshit.

[MiniNinja6]

GTX 950 is $120. It'll even play a handful of family games and lots of indies(bonus). Though, you could stream to your HTPC or just get a Wii U for living room gaming.

 

If there is an HDMI 2.0 card for $120 then I'll look into it, that is a much more reasonable price for this use case scenario. But I'm still not sure it's worth it just for 60Hz over 30Hz

[TymmVonD]

Have you ever been to a movie theater? That movie was in 24fps. Standard HD TV from a satelite or cable provider is only 25fps. You would need a bionic eye to notice a delay caused by 30fps. Input lag has nothing to do with the refresh rate or frame rate of the display, and even if it did I'm not paying $500 for a GPU and PSU that can power it just to have a less laggy cursor, that;s just absolute bullshit.

Except the Hobbit(48fps) and rumored to be Avatar 2. Sports broadcasts and soaps are at 60hz. British TV is at 50Hz, I believe. The lag I was referring to is caused by the smooth motion processing done by the TV. My TV has 87ms latency with all enabled. Setting to PC mode cuts the delay down a bit, but the 30Hz flicker was unbearable for me. I am, honestly, just trying to help. No other motives. I've been there. I searched and searched for DP to HDMI 2.0 adapters and even called Startech to see when/if they were coming out. 30Hz just didn't cut it for me. Especially on a $2700 UHDTV.

[TymmVonD]

Back when 980 was announced at nvidias event, I was on their stream via skype. They let us ask questions. I wanted to know if 2.0 functionality would be placed in a driver update for my 780 Tis and if not, could I send them in and trade for a 980. lol. Was really cool.

[MiniNinja6]

Except the Hobbit(48fps) and rumored to be Avatar 2. Sports broadcasts and soaps are at 60hz. British TV is at 50Hz, I believe. The lag I was referring to is caused by the smooth motion processing done by the TV. My TV has 87ms latency with all enabled. Setting to PC mode cuts the delay down a bit, but the 30Hz flicker was unbearable for me. I am, honestly, just trying to help. No other motives. I've been there. I searched and searched for DP to HDMI 2.0 adapters and even called Startech to see when/if they were coming out. 30Hz just didn't cut it for me. Especially on a $2700 UHDTV.

 

With a gtx 950 on Amazon for only $120 with prime shipping I'm definitely going to go for that. Do I need a somewhat decent CPU with the 950? Would something like a Pentium G3258 work?

 

Also, I have plugged my laptop into the TV over HDMI and displayed 1080p to it, and the input lag was very noticeable when searching for videos and such, but it was very bearable and didn't bother me at all, I guess I was expecting it. The 30fps wasn't noticeable to me, maybe it just has to do with your TV, but I can see the potential for some living room gaming that would be much more enjoyable at 60fps.

[MiniNinja6]

Back when 980 was announced at nvidias event, I was on their stream via skype. They let us ask questions. I wanted to know if 2.0 functionality would be placed in a driver update for my 780 Tis and if not, could I send them in and trade for a 980. lol. Was really cool.

 

That would be awesome but it's probably hardware limited meaning a software update wouldn't be able to upgrade it. Why are there no display port to HDMI 2 adapters? Isn't it just a matter of taking the pin-outs from the display port and putting them in the right place on the pin-outs from an HDMI plug? Maybe It's like a usb 3 and 2 situation where you can go from usb 2 to 3 but there aren't enough pins to properly do it (does that make sense?)

[TymmVonD]

That would be awesome but it's probably hardware limited meaning a software update wouldn't be able to upgrade it

Exactly why I upgraded. Def hardware.

[MiniNinja6]

Exactly why I upgraded. Def hardware.

 

Yeah, but while everyone else is shitting their pants over 5k and even 8k, I'm still plenty happy with my 1080p gaming computer !

 

Any thoughts on the CPU?

With a gtx 950 on Amazon for only $120 with prime shipping I'm definitely going to go for that. Do I need a somewhat decent CPU with the 950? Would something like a Pentium G3258 work?

...

[TymmVonD]

Yeah, but while everyone else is shitting their pants over 5k and even 8k, I'm still plenty happy with my 1080p gaming computer !

 

Any thoughts on the CPU?

G3258 would be perfect. Mobo with wifi. I would recommend a 120 or 240GB SSD instead of a small HDD. Can find Sandisk or adata 240s for $60. Personally, I stream everything to my HTPC from my desktop. You'll still have plenty room left over for programs and a handful of games. Can't beat the price on the CX430 and right at 50%(220w) power usage is where you wanna be, especially on a bronze PSU. A TV remote sized bluetooth keyboard and mouse works wonders.

[TymmVonD]

That would be awesome but it's probably hardware limited meaning a software update wouldn't be able to upgrade it. Why are there no display port to HDMI 2 adapters? Isn't it just a matter of taking the pin-outs from the display port and putting them in the right place on the pin-outs from an HDMI plug? Maybe It's like a usb 3 and 2 situation where you can go from usb 2 to 3 but there aren't enough pins to properly do it (does that make sense?)

From what I understand, the power difference and the pixel clocks being different over the 2 requires an active adapter.

[The_Stig]

Thank you, that's exactly the price point I was looking at without a discrete gpu. 

 

Also, I don't have a lot of experience with Linux but considering all I need is a java/html capable web browser and a program to play mp4s and DVDs, a free Linux build seems like the way to go. But, can they scale to 4k? (I have almost no experience so sorry for the maybe stupid question)

Linux can scale to 4k (at least I think Ubuntu can)  Also, my build included a GPU (250) that supports 4k though both the HDMI and DisplayPort.

[Clanscorpia]

If you think you need a good GPU for light gaming or anything like that if you want to you really don't, my laptop has an E1-2500 APU and runs CS:GO at 30ish frames with some dips to 25ish, not half bad. My Granny's i3 4170 handles it at a steady 50-60 so you'd be good for light gaming with anything like that. Same with 4K output, you don't need a super good GPU, integrated grapics aren't half bad unless you really want super amazing visuals or hundreds of frames. Most high end games will run at 60 frames at 1080p with most settings on high with a 950, you'll be fine using integrated graphics

[monjanger]

Nvidia Shield android console? Given that any thought?