Need some video recording advice.

[trag1c]

So I have been asked by my former high school drama to film this years production (they do a full broadway musical script.) so I was wondering what settings and equipment I should have to give them the best possible audio and video. It doesn't have to be perfect but I would like to give them something high quality since It will be the students who see this and are going to receive a copy of it for their memories.

 

I will be using a Canon EO5 Rebel T2i as well as a Soligor T157 tripod that came with the camera. I have 2 zoom lenses. one is EF-S 18-55mm the other is EF 75-300mm. The environment that the video will be in a theatre with rapidly changing lighting conditions. A lot of high wattage theatre lights, cyclorama lights with a cyc fabric background, as well as laser. There are also very large speakers throughout the house. Length of the show  is anywhere from 1.5 - 2.5 hour show. Camera will most likely be about 40ft away from the centre of the stage. 

 

I plan on recording 1920x1080 24FPS while keeping the camera stationary on the tripod with a wide enough angle to capture the entire stage. I am thinking about picking up this SDXC card for the camera http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/sony-sony-64gb-94mb-s-sdxc-memory-card-sf64ux2-tq/10389978.aspx?path=667a3c1778196666e6b80789a657667aen02

 

So what can I do to produce higher quality video for them? I will be recording audio with the camera and as well as with the tons of audio recording equipment that the theatre has to offer and then removing or adding the audio to the video based on which source is better.

[ALwin]

snip

 

I'll get back to you later today with some advice, if any can be given.

[trag1c]

I'll get back to you later today with some advice, if any can be given.

Sounds good. Thank you for the reply.

[nickl]

I would guarantee that the audio from the mix from the board would be better than the mic in the camera. Camera mics usually suck, and are good for home vids, and probably won't handle loud, or reverb-y spaces.

Also, is your school running the hall, or are they hiring people to do it? If people are being hired to run the BTS, I would talk to them to see what they are doing, so you can work with them.

One thing you will have to figure out is how to sync the audio from the board and the audio/video from your camera. As both sources will have audio, that should help, and since it should be one long shot, it shouldn't be too hard.

 

Good Luck! 

[trag1c]

I would guarantee that the audio from the mix from the board would be better than the mic in the camera. Camera mics usually suck, and are good for home vids, and probably won't handle loud, or reverb-y spaces.

Also, is your school running the hall, or are they hiring people to do it? If people are being hired to run the BTS, I would talk to them to see what they are doing, so you can work with them.

One thing you will have to figure out is how to sync the audio and video from the board and the audio/video from your camera. As both sources will have audio, that should help, and since it should be one long shot, it shouldn't be too hard.

 

Good Luck! 

The theatre is owned by the school and the entire production is run by the students excluding the director which is the teacher as well as various other mentors such as my self. I mentor some of the technical theatre side of things as well as various IT issues. For syncing audio I was thinking about getting up on stage before the show officially begins and making a loud clap.

[nickl]

The theatre is owned by the school and the entire production is run by the students excluding the director which is the teacher as well as various other mentors such as my self. I mentor some of the technical theatre side of things as well as various IT issues. For syncing audio I was thinking about getting up on stage before the show officially begins and making a loud clap.

That's sounds like a good plan... Have you figured out how you are going to record the audio from the board?

[trag1c]

That's sounds like a good plan... Have you figured out how you are going to record the audio from the board?

I think I will setup my laptop in the tech booth and record audio through the microphone jack with a 3.5mm male ended cable connected to an output on the board. I think they're 1/4'' jacks at the back but I have adapters that I use for my headphones that I could use. For mics there is 3x2 array of hanging mics for voice pickup on stage as well as various cardioid mics that I could set up.(not sure if we have any omnidirectional or stereo mics but I am sure I can rig something up if need be.)

[nickl]

I think I will setup my laptop in the tech booth and record audio through the microphone jack with a 3.5mm male ended cable connected to an output on the board. I think they're 1/4'' jacks at the back but I have adapters that I use for my headphones that I could use. For mics there is 3x2 array of hanging mics for voice pickup on stage as well as various cardioid mics that I could set up.(not sure if we have any omnidirectional or stereo mics but I am sure I can rig something up if need be.)

OK, are you planning on being in the tech booth, or by your camera for the show?

Using the hanging mics on stage should be good. I probably would test the recording setup before the night of the show, say at a dress rehearsal or something to make sure your setup works out right.

[ALwin]

Ok I'm sure you may have already considered some of what I will say.  If there are going to be several more rehearsals before the actual production date, I suggest you go to as many as possible and try filming and recording audio.

 

While the larger sensor of the T2i will certainly have an advantage over consumer camcorders with smaller sensors, there are also inherent disadvantages of being a photo camera first.

 

1. Focusing

Since you are planning to keep the camera stationary, this already makes life a bit easier.  You should avoid using a wide aperture as the DOF will be very shallow and hard to keep people moving on the stage in focus.  Better to stop down your aperture for a wider DOF.  You will also need to be careful with setting up the focusing, as I don't think you have a field monitor with focus assist features.

 

2. Exposure

With a narrower aperture for a wider DOF there will be less light coming into the camera.  So you should boost your ISO.  Increasing your ISO somewhat above the camera's base ISO (normally 100 or 200) can sometimes lead to a better dynamic range for the camera.  I recommend an ISO between 800-2000.

 

3. Avoid any auto settings, disable auto (ISO, Aperture, Shutter, Focus).  1080p 24p the most common shutter speed would be double the frame rate, 1/50, so your exposure correction will depend on ISO.  Also disable auto white balance, you can process in post later.  I recommend you set a manual WB between 3200-5500K.

 

4. You're dealing with changing lighting conditions.  The camera's dynamic range should be able to handle a 1-2 stops of over exposure, so don't set your camera to expose for the brightest scene.  And obviously NOT for the darkest scene.

 

For audio, external recordings will be better than the in-camera mic.  Though I would rather use an external audio recorder than a laptop.

 

So just take what I have said into consideration and during the rehearsals go film and experiment to see which settings will work.  Each recording environment is different.  The settings that work in one will not always work in another.

[trag1c]

Sorry I haven't replied but I have been busy with the production.

OK, are you planning on being in the tech booth, or by your camera for the show?

Using the hanging mics on stage should be good. I probably would test the recording setup before the night of the show, say at a dress rehearsal or something to make sure your setup works out right.

I have to sit with the camera because apparently it only records up to 4GB file sizes. I have to make make sure to start and stop recordings during blackouts. Unfortunetly the sound board will not work out as the hanging mics won't be able to record people who are out and about in the house. And they also don't record the music since they're tuned and directed for voice. But its not a big deal as I was listening to the video clips earlier and the audio isn't great by any means but its more than sufficient.

Ok I'm sure you may have already considered some of what I will say.  If there are going to be several more rehearsals before the actual production date, I suggest you go to as many as possible and try filming and recording audio.

 

While the larger sensor of the T2i will certainly have an advantage over consumer camcorders with smaller sensors, there are also inherent disadvantages of being a photo camera first.

 

1. Focusing

Since you are planning to keep the camera stationary, this already makes life a bit easier.  You should avoid using a wide aperture as the DOF will be very shallow and hard to keep people moving on the stage in focus.  Better to stop down your aperture for a wider DOF.  You will also need to be careful with setting up the focusing, as I don't think you have a field monitor with focus assist features.

 

2. Exposure

With a narrower aperture for a wider DOF there will be less light coming into the camera.  So you should boost your ISO.  Increasing your ISO somewhat above the camera's base ISO (normally 100 or 200) can sometimes lead to a better dynamic range for the camera.  I recommend an ISO between 800-2000.

 

3. Avoid any auto settings, disable auto (ISO, Aperture, Shutter, Focus).  1080p 24p the most common shutter speed would be double the frame rate, 1/50, so your exposure correction will depend on ISO.  Also disable auto white balance, you can process in post later.  I recommend you set a manual WB between 3200-5500K.

 

4. You're dealing with changing lighting conditions.  The camera's dynamic range should be able to handle a 1-2 stops of over exposure, so don't set your camera to expose for the brightest scene.  And obviously NOT for the darkest scene.

 

For audio, external recordings will be better than the in-camera mic.  Though I would rather use an external audio recorder than a laptop.

 

So just take what I have said into consideration and during the rehearsals go film and experiment to see which settings will work.  Each recording environment is different.  The settings that work in one will not always work in another.

Thanks for the advice. I did a lot of filming today. I found my self using 3200 ISO most of the time. with max aperture (f/4) and 1/60 shutter so it was far from optimal to get decent exposure. I was also focusing the camera quite a bit because of DOF but this wasn't a huge issue since I was using the EOS software with my laptop to live view the video on my laptop. The film is pretty grainy but it can probably be fixed in post. I'm going to be re filming the entire thing again on Tuesday then choosing the best clips from each and sequencing them in post. 

[ALwin]

I have to sit with the camera because apparently it only records up to 4GB file sizes. 

 

This is where having an external recorder like an Atomos Ninja is helpful as it takes the HDMI out of the DSLR and records continuously, automatically segmenting the files as necessary without ever stopping unless you tell it to.  However the downside with this is that the DSLR has to be on liveview mode and some DSLR's have a power saving feature that will automatically turn live view off after a certain number of minutes if you're not there to monitor it.

 

The second downside to using a DSLR is, unless you have an AC adapter, I wouldn't use it to record video continuously for hours.

[trag1c]

This is where having an external recorder like an Atomos Ninja is helpful as it takes the HDMI out of the DSLR and records continuously, automatically segmenting the files as necessary without ever stopping unless you tell it to.  However the downside with this is that the DSLR has to be on liveview mode and some DSLR's have a power saving feature that will automatically turn live view off after a certain number of minutes if you're not there to monitor it.

 

The second downside to using a DSLR is, unless you have an AC adapter, I wouldn't use it to record video continuously for hours.

Yeah I am learning that these cameras have many caveats for recording video. Luckily for me blackouts are frequent enough to start and stop recordings without missing dialogue or action. For the battery issues I have bought a grip that carries 2 batteries as well as 2 high capacitance batteries. It's enough to get me through a performance and a bit but I would have to agree with you since they really don't last all that long. 

 

I am rapidly developing a great respect for people who do this professionally since there is a lot of technique needed and possibly equipment depending on circumstances.

[ALwin]

Yeah I am learning that these cameras have many caveats for recording video. Luckily for me blackouts are frequent enough to start and stop recordings without missing dialogue or action. For the battery issues I have bought a grip that carries 2 batteries as well as 2 high capacitance batteries. It's enough to get me through a performance and a bit but I would have to agree with you since they really don't last all that long. 

 

I am rapidly developing a great respect for people who do this professionally since there is a lot of technique needed and possibly equipment depending on circumstances.

 

Alright, and it would be great if you can share how things turned out.

 

Personally while I think that DSLRs or other large sensor photo cameras that can record video are great, it depends on where they are being used.  Obviously Hollywood film makers can make the best use of them because they also have the budget to invest in additional accessories.  All the cool gadgets.

 

But if someone is doing a live broadcast or filming things that need to be recorded continuously a proper video camera would seem to be a better choice.  Even people who use photo cameras for video, like those who produce indie films or tv shows, they don't record continuously.  They record their scenes in short takes.