Opinions on Canon 10-18mm

[Swndlr]

Ive read around and seen some quite positive feedback related to this lens and for its price it seems like its worth a shot, Im not looking to spend loads on L glass yet, so it seems logical to start with a mid to low price lens like this to get myself into ultra wide angle photography to see if I even enjoy it, then at that point would I invest in something more expensive. What are you opinions, should I get one? My one thought is the fact that its APS-C only, but I dont plan to go full frame any time soon, and by then odds are Id shell out more money for nicer glass anyway.

Would I be better off with something from Rokinon or any third party, if they have better offerings for similar if not the same price?

 

Link: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1051476-USA/canon_9519b002_ef_s_10_18mm_f_4_5_5_6_is.html

Hearing a referral from Kai convinces me that it seems like a good buy for what it is and what I want to do with photography:

 

[johnt]

It's APS-C only and it's variable aperture. Move on.

 

If you aren't ready to spend money on L lenses yet, then just continue to wait.

[Swndlr]

It's APS-C only and it's variable aperture. Move on.

 

If you aren't ready to spend money on L lenses yet, then just continue to wait.

If you read, you would know I dont plan to go full frame any time soon. And how am I supposed to find out what focal lengths I enjoy shooting at if I dont start small? I dont see a point in spending all the money for L glass just to find out I dont enjoy the focal length it offers.

[johnt]

If you read, you would know I dont plan to go full frame any time soon. And how am I supposed to find out what focal lengths I enjoy shooting at if I dont start small? I dont see a point in spending all the money for L glass just to find out I dont enjoy the focal length it offers.

 

Oh I can read perfectly fine. But I encourage you to read the market a little better. Nikon is pushing away from crop sensors, and Canon is sure to follow.

 

I've owned a lot of cheapo little lenses. Unfortunately all I did was waste a bunch of money on them. I'm trying to give you advice from my experience.

 

Splurge on your wide angle and telephoto lenses. You won't be sorry. For the stuff in between, buy primes instead of zooms.

 

You might not be upgrading to full frame any time soon... but the market isn't going to wait for you.

[Bsmith]

It's APS-C only and it's variable aperture. Move on.

If you aren't ready to spend money on L lenses yet, then just continue to wait.

This would only count if OP was planning to go full frame and every pens these days has a variable aperture ao your argument is kind of invalid.

@OP(couldnt multiquote due to phone)

From what I red the 10-18mm is a pretty decent lens, but since it's APS-C it focal length has to be recalculted, making it a 13-23.4mm lens, which is still pretty damn wide, but since it is so wide it might have a fish-eye effect on it, which can be pretty annoying if you aren't used to it.

I didn't look up any optical tests about it so I can't say alot abou the image quality or if the fish-eye effect really is a problem or not.

If you want to safe money and play it safe I would get a samyang lens, sinply said a chinese clone of canon lenses but their optical formula appears to be the same of their expensive counter parts.

[bob345]

Its about the best wide angle zoom you can get for canon for the money. It will not do great in low light, but everywhere else it does great. It is sharp, cheap, and includes image stabilization. If you want a wide lens that does well in lower light, i would go for a rokinon 14mm prime. It is a bit more than the canon, but at f2.8 lets in a considerable more light.

 

 

It's APS-C only and it's variable aperture. Move on.

 

If you aren't ready to spend money on L lenses yet, then just continue to wait.

Really man? no need to be a snob. Not everyone wants to or can spend 3 grand on a 11-24 l lens.

[ALwin]

snip

 

The best wide angle lens you can get for a cropped sensor is the Tokina 11-16 f/2.8 or the 11-20 f/2.8, but if they are above your budget the Canon you have selected is the next best thing.  Apart from fisheye lenses, 10mm or 11mm lenses are the widest you can go for an APS-C camera.

 

Rokinon and Samyang lenses were for people who have really tiny budgets, but the Canon 10-18 you are looking at will now beat them in every aspect except for the f/2.8 capability, and the Tokina beats them all.  So if your budget is not limited and you want the best, get the Tokina.

 

And I am not saying this just by looking at the specifications. I have experience with the Tokina and Rokinon/Samyang lenses.  So far neither Canon or Nikon has created a super wide angle lens with f/2.8 constant aperture for APS-C cameras that rival the Tokina.

[Swndlr]

The best wide angle lens you can get for a cropped sensor is the Tokina 11-16 f/2.8 or the 11-20 f/2.8, but if they are above your budget the Canon you have selected is the next best thing.  Apart from fisheye lenses, 10mm or 11mm lenses are the widest you can go for an APS-C camera.

 

Rokinon and Samyang lenses were for people who have really tiny budgets, but the Canon 10-18 you are looking at will now beat them in every aspect except for the f/2.8 capability, and the Tokina beats them all.  So if your budget is not limited and you want the best, get the Tokina.

 

And I am not saying this just by looking at the specifications. I have experience with the Tokina and Rokinon/Samyang lenses.  So far neither Canon or Nikon has created a super wide angle lens with f/2.8 constant aperture for APS-C cameras that rival the Tokina.

Thanks for the advice rather than just "oh fuck that go L or go home"

Ill take a look at the Tokina as well.

[ALwin]

Thanks for the advice rather than just "oh fuck that go L or go home"

Ill take a look at the Tokina as well.

 

By the way, the Rokinon and Samyang lenses are manual focus lenses.  It's really hard to manually focus a wide angle lens with a cropped sensor camera, even if you use live view mode.

 

Also, unless you plan to upgrade to a full frame body in a few years, don't invest in wide angle lenses designed for full frame cameras, you will lose the full width of the FOV due to the crop factor.  The only full frame lenses recommended for cropped sensors are on the longer focal length side.

[johnt]

Thanks for the advice rather than just "oh fuck that go L or go home"

Ill take a look at the Tokina as well.

 

There's no reason to get harsh. You asked for opinions, I gave you my opinion. If you didn't like it, say thanks anyway and move on. My message is clear: don't waste your money.

 

What do you plan to do with your equipment anyway? Are you trying to go pro eventually or just taking pictures for fun with zero intent to becoming a pro photographer?

[ALwin]

 Nikon is pushing away from crop sensors, and Canon is sure to follow.

 

There's just one problem, for Nikon or Canon to move away from cropped sensors... they would have to redesign their entire lot of DX/EF-S lenses.  From a financial and marketing perspective there is absolutely no way they would drop their entry level to mid range prosumer line of cameras.

 

There is absolutely no way they would make a $500 full frame interchangeable lens camera.

[ALwin]

@OP(couldnt multiquote due to phone)

From what I red the 10-18mm is a pretty decent lens, but since it's APS-C it focal length has to be recalculted, making it a 13-23.4mm lens, which is still pretty damn wide, but since it is so wide it might have a fish-eye effect on it, which can be pretty annoying if you aren't used to it.

I didn't look up any optical tests about it so I can't say alot abou the image quality or if the fish-eye effect really is a problem or not.

If you want to safe money and play it safe I would get a samyang lens, sinply said a chinese clone of canon lenses but their optical formula appears to be the same of their expensive counter parts.

 

• A 10-18 lens on the OP's camera is going to be equivalent to 16-28.8mm on full frame.  Canon's APS-C crop factor is 1.6, while most others are 1.5.
• A super wide angle lens or ultra wide angle lens, however people refer to it, does not produce fisheye effect. There will be a bit of distortion, easily fixable in post, but not like a fisheye lens.  A fisheye lens' distortion is much more extreme.

 

@OP

And the reason for getting a wide angle lens

[johnt]

There's just one problem, for Nikon or Canon to move away from cropped sensors... they would have to redesign their entire lot of DX/EF-S lenses.  From a financial and marketing perspective there is absolutely no way they would drop their entry level to mid range prosumer line of cameras.

 

There is absolutely no way they would make a $500 full frame interchangeable lens camera.

 

Just keep telling yourself that.

 

Why would they have to redesign anything? Nikon and Canon have been making full frame lenses for much longer than crop-specific lenses. In fact, one could have used your argument to say Nikon and Canon won't adopt crop sensor technology because they would have to design all new lenses. But they did anyway.

 

The only thing Nikon and Canon would have to do is ditch their crop specific lenses and stop producing crop sensor cameras. Would it piss people off? Absolutely. But I suspect it would upset most of the beginning enthusiasts that one day planned to purchase a full frame anyway... they just didn't do it fast enough and invested way too much money in crop-specific lenses. Some parent who bought a crop sensor camera to take some pics of his kids this year doesn't care.

 

It would be a hard blow to beginning enthusiasts, but it would ultimately be a great financial decision for both companies.

 

Buying a crop sensor camera, even worse, a crop-specific lens in 2015 is a bad investment.

 

I'm not trying to start any arguments here. I've given my thoughts to the OP. I will now retract to the rock that I seem to be living under.

[bob345]

Just keep telling yourself that.

 

Why would they have to redesign anything? Nikon and Canon have been making full frame lenses for much longer than crop-specific lenses. In fact, one could have used your argument to say Nikon and Canon won't adopt crop sensor technology because they would have to design all new lenses. But they did anyway.

 

The only thing Nikon and Canon would have to do is ditch their crop specific lenses and stop producing crop sensor cameras. Would it piss people off? Absolutely. But I suspect it would upset most of the beginning enthusiasts that one day planned to purchase a full frame anyway... they just didn't do it fast enough and invested way too much money in crop-specific lenses. Some parent who bought a crop sensor camera to take some pics of his kids this year doesn't care.

 

It would be a hard blow to beginning enthusiasts, but it would ultimately be a great financial decision for both companies.

 

Buying a crop sensor camera, even worse, a crop-specific lens in 2015 is a bad investment.

 

I'm not trying to start any arguments here. I've given my thoughts to the OP. I will now retract to the rock that I seem to be living under.

Nikon and canon will likely never drop their crop sensor cameras. You know why? Because the cheaper cameras sell better and have a higher margin. They make more money off of the crop sensor stuff than they do the full frame stuff. Canon also just developed a 250 megapixel :"crop" sensor. Now, do you really think they would spend that much on r&d on something they will never use? didn't think so.

[johnt]

Nikon and canon will likely never drop their crop sensor cameras. You know why? Because the cheaper cameras sell better and have a higher margin. They make more money off of the crop sensor stuff than they do the full frame stuff. Canon also just developed a 250 megapixel :"crop" sensor. Now, do you really think they would spend that much on r&d on something they will never use? didn't think so.

 

Umm where's your proof that profit margins are greater on crop sensor cameras? They may sell a larger quantity and therefore have a large profit source from crop sensors at this time, but I think they can easily replace it with full frame cameras and maintain profit margins.

 

Straight from the horses mouth: http://www.canon.com/news/2015/sep07e.html

 

Read the last sentence on that link. Canon has no intention of commercializing this sensor anytime soon.

 

 

It shocks me... really... a 250 megapixel sensor... from Canon's own website... a new cropped sensor nonetheless... using a full frame, L series lens. All that R&D on a sensor... no new lens?

 

Remember. The OP asked if he should purchase a particular crop sensor specific lens. The answer is: no.

[bob345]

Umm where's your proof that profit margins are greater on crop sensor cameras? They may sell a larger quantity and therefore have a large profit source from crop sensors at this time, but I think they can easily replace it with full frame cameras and maintain profit margins.

 

Straight from the horses mouth: http://www.canon.com/news/2015/sep07e.html

 

Read the last sentence on that link. Canon has no intention of commercializing this sensor anytime soon.

 

canon_250mp_L_lens.jpg

 

It shocks me... really... a 250 megapixel sensor... from Canon's own website... a new cropped sensor nonetheless... using a full frame, L series lens. All that R&D on a sensor... no new lens?

 

Remember. The OP asked if he should purchase a particular crop sensor specific lens. The answer is: no.

I dont think you understand, fullframe sensors will never reach a similar profitmargin to a crop sensor. The way they are produced makes it impossible. Its the same reason you dont see chip manufactures simply making larger chips to achieve higher performance. Its not cost effective. The more space a chip takes up on a wafer, the more likely you will get a non functioning chip and. Price and failures goes up exponentially when you make a chip larger.

[ALwin]

snip

Just because you feel that people need to eventually get full frame cameras does not mean companies will stop making them. Not even if you wish companies to stop making them. APS-C, MFT and other format cameras are selling well.  Why don't you go around and ask pro photographers if they think companies should stop producing cropped sensor cameras.

 

Not everyone in the world can afford a full frame body and the expensive collection of lenses that come with it.  Nor is everyone able to switch camera formats easily.  Finally there are applications where using cropped sensors make better sense than full frame or larger formats.

 

As for whether the OP should purchase a FF lens or a lens specific for his camera, the decision is his to make.

 

I dont think you understand, fullframe sensors will never reach a similar profitmargin to a crop sensor. The way they are produced makes it impossible. Its the same reason you dont see chip manufactures simply making larger chips to achieve higher performance. Its not cost effective. The more space a chip takes up on a wafer, the more likely you will get a non functioning chip and. Price and failures goes up exponentially when you make a chip larger.

Not to mention it costs more to make larger sensors and the glass for them, hence the price.

[Swndlr]

 

 

snip

 

Remember. The OP asked if he should purchase a particular crop sensor specific lens. The answer is: no.

But if Im not going full frame whats the difference, a crop sensor isnt really a setback for me, I feel its a better option for most beginners.

[ALwin]

But if Im not going full frame whats the difference, a crop sensor isnt really a setback for me, I feel its a better option for most beginners.

 

There is nothing absolutely wrong with using a cropped sensor camera.

 

Apart from the slight improvement in shallower DOF for that artistic look, APS-C sensors and Full Frame sensors do not have huge differences.  Sensor technology is improving to the point where performance gains such as low light and high ISO noise handling in FF are no longer such a big deal.

 

The only difference now between cropped sensor cameras and FF sensor bodies would be the features manufacturers include, such as plastic composite bodies for the low end cameras and magnesium alloy bodies for high end models.  Weather sealing, durability, some functionality.  At least 50% of the money you pay for a FF camera body is in those areas and not the sensor.

 

The other big difference would be the lenses, but then of course you would also have to spend at least double if not triple or more for FF lenses compared to cropped lenses.

 

E.g. The Tokina 11-20 f/2.8 lens costs about $500, the focal length translates to 17.6-32 on 35mm equivalent.  The Full Frame Canon 16-35 f/2.8 lens costs $1500.  For the camera bodies they are designed to be used on, both lenses perform equally well.

[.spider.]

Lenses extremely stable in their value, so if you buy a camera with a 35mm you can sell the EF-s lenses with a little loss.

Except they are dropping the whole EF Line

[Swndlr]

There is nothing absolutely wrong with using a cropped sensor camera.

 

Apart from the slight improvement in shallower DOF for that artistic look, APS-C sensors and Full Frame sensors do not have huge differences.  Sensor technology is improving to the point where performance gains such as low light and high ISO noise handling in FF are no longer such a big deal.

 

The only difference now between cropped sensor cameras and FF sensor bodies would be the features manufacturers include, such as plastic composite bodies for the low end cameras and magnesium alloy bodies for high end models.  Weather sealing, durability, some functionality.  At least 50% of the money you pay for a FF camera body is in those areas and not the sensor.

 

The other big difference would be the lenses, but then of course you would also have to spend at least double if not triple or more for FF lenses compared to cropped lenses.

 

E.g. The Tokina 11-20 f/2.8 lens costs about $500, the focal length translates to 17.6-32 on 35mm equivalent.  The Full Frame Canon 16-35 f/2.8 lens costs $1500.  For the camera bodies they are designed to be used on, both lenses perform equally well.

For my cost and photography needs, I dont really need to worry too much for the high end stuff, Ive used some crazy expensive gear before simply because Ik some people that have it, and its nice an all but not necessary

[kirashi]

Its about the best wide angle zoom you can get for canon for the money. It will not do great in low light, but everywhere else it does great. It is sharp, cheap, and includes image stabilization. If you want a wide lens that does well in lower light, i would go for a rokinon 14mm prime. It is a bit more than the canon, but at f2.8 lets in a considerable more light.

 

 

Really man? no need to be a snob. Not everyone wants to or can spend 3 grand on a 11-24 l lens.

 

Going to agree here with @bob345's statement: it's one of the best wide-frame Canon lenses for the money if you're just starting out, alongside Sigma's 12-24mm lens.

 

Is it going to take ultra sharp photos in all lighting conditions? Hell no.

But you said wanted to try out different focal lengths @Swndlr, so sure, give it a shot and sell it if you don't like it.

 

Generally I agree and follow most of DigitalRev's Kai's recommendations because they state the truths about everything they review, sometimes quite bluntly. Not sure how Canon, or Nikon haven't sued the crap out of them after some of the features he calls "bullshit" (literally) on during the videos

[Williamchan87]

Depends what type of wideangle photography you are taking if its landscape I do recommend Rokinon/Samyang/Bower/and the 50 other rebrand names they have for them, which would be fine for manual focusing, if you are for some reason taking wide angle street photography or people, then stick with the canon 10-18, so you can focus alot faster IMO.

 

Personally I love manual wo I would always go for the Rokinon, got to love the Wide apertures.

[Williamchan87]

@kirashi I doubt they would ever sue digitalrev since they have a large business partnership with each other, just Like when Linus Nails some of his biggest sponsors, with criticism about somethings.

[Kereplaz]

Theres no question here. Get this lens. Its very fun to use and has good quality optics. You dont need large max aperture on a UWA. Besides It does have IS. Also for that guy banging on APSC lenses, i modded this lens to go on full frame and you get even more dramatic usable pictures from 14 mm. No lens can beat this one at the moment in many regards.