2 AMD 390's VS. AMD Fury(not X)

[Misteryman321]

My main gaming rig is a main AMD rig. I own an 8350 with 16gb of Ram and an old 7970. I've got the money now to upgrade some stuff and turn my PC from a 1080p machine to a 1440p machine and i want to max out every game i throw at it. I was going to buy the Sapphire Tri-X Fury but then i started looking about and thought if I get 2 390's and Crossfire them, its going to cost around $100 more and get possibly better performance. I know SLI/CF are still in its infancy and its not the best to try but I feel in most games I play that don't support the 1 390 can handle it. I feel that the only reason to stop me at this point to not get the 2 390's is either its a ripoff or my processor is going to bottleneck. I know the 2 390's makes it closer to the Fury X price range but I don't want to buy a water cooled graphics card and I don't want to be strapped down to only 4gb. Is this a good idea or am I just stupid and should go for the Fury/FuryX?

[Fulgrim]

How about get one R9 390, then put the leftover cash towards an i5 + new mobo?

[Clyne]

Your not going to get any more FPS with a 390 X2/Fury unless it's a game like Tomb Raider that is heavily GPU dependent......

Tahiti is the highest that you can go on Vishera without any major bottlenecks. 

Just upgrade to Skylake/Haswell and you'll see a performance boost in almost every game. 

If you just get another 280X/7970 with a Haswell/Skylake CPU, you'll be fine at 1440P. 

[,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,]

How about get one R9 390, then put the leftover cash towards an i5 + new mobo?

 

Strongly agreed.

[Sam Z Man]

A 8350 is a bad idea with 390 CF or Fury.

[handymanshandle]

How about get one R9 390, then put the leftover cash towards an i5 + new mobo?

If he's doing more mult-threaded stuff that'd be a bit of a downgrade.

 

So no, probably two 390s will be fine even at 1440p.

[shypin]

7970 doesnt perform that bad in todays games

you could probably just get another one of that

 

if you really want the 300 series tho i heard that you can "unlock" some of those cards to become a full fury x

[dizmo]

The 390x is pretty much the same as a Fury in terms of performance.

So. If you OC the 390, theoretically you'll get the same performance as a Fury.

 

Scale from there.

 

IMO the Fury is a useless card.

[shypin]

If he's doing more mult-threaded stuff that'd be a bit of a downgrade.

 

So no, probably two 390s will be fine even at 1440p.

but a current generation i5 outperforms fx8350 in both single core and multi core performance

[Fulgrim]

If he's doing more mult-threaded stuff that'd be a bit of a downgrade.

 

So no, probably two 390s will be fine even at 1440p.

OP only stated to game, not render/livestream. If that's the case, then of course an i7 would be better.

[Fulgrim]

but i5 outperforms fx8350 in both single core and multi core performance

If you actually try x264 encoding for a livestream rig, the FX8350 does a better job because of the core count. But raw fps-wise, the i5 will be better. 

[Clyne]

but i5 outperforms fx8350 in both single core and multi core performance

.......

Different generations come and go by.

Nehalem= FX beats it both ways.

2500K vs FX 8350 in multi threaded at stock speeds= FX

3570K vs 8350 in multi threaded in stock= FX

At Haswell...it's mostly locked i5 otherwise 4690K and up beats it in everything. 

[Clyne]

OP only stated to game, not render/livestream. If that's the case, then of course an i7 would be better.

*Xeon 1231 V3 on budget

[shypin]

.......

Different generations come and go by.

Nehalem= FX beats it both ways.

2500K vs FX 8350 in multi threaded at stock speeds= FX

3570K vs 8350 in multi threaded in stock= FX

At Haswell...it's mostly locked i5 otherwise 4690K and up beats it in everything. 

well i meant current gen i5 such as the 6600k and the 4690k

[Clyne]

well i meant current gen i5 such as the 6600k and the 4690k

You should have been more specific.

[handymanshandle]

but i5 outperforms fx8350 in both single core and multi core performance

OP only stated to game, not render/livestream. If that's the case, then of course an i7 would be better.

No shit, but i7s cost about twice as much an 8350 and reading through the OP he did mention gaming but there's a chance that's not the only thing OP does.

 

Intel obviously beats out AMD but if OP already has an okay CPU.

 

(BTW at least with Geekbench scores the FX 8350 isn't too far off from the i5 4690K)

World of Warcraft a game that is CPU intensive seems to not have any issue with the FX 8350 at 1080p I'd suspect that the story would be same at 1440p.

[Misteryman321]

Wow. was not expecting that many replies in such a short of time. my budget is $1,500, and most of it is towards a new monitor (Freesync 1440p) and stuff i need to replace. my gaming mouse died on me and a new case cause its awful in airflow. So from what i hear is don't get 2 390's get 1 390x and get an i5.. I completly agree that my 8350 is getting a little long in the tooth but it hasn't bottlenecked me yet in any of my gaming.

New Case:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00NGMIBUU?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_1&smid=A3DRD2WX13H6ZQ

New Monitor:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00VRCLHYS?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_7&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

New Mouse:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00MYTSDU4?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=ox_sc_act_title_6&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

[Ramontes]

the 390 alone can handle 1440p gaming 45-70fps and if youre on a 60hz monitor it should be good, according to erurogamers benchmarks however if you want a more consistant 50+ fps average the fury should do just fine, however i would personally go for the single 390 (or two in your case) simply for the 8gb vram in order to kick up anti-aliasing a lot. just be aware of temperatures and power consumption, in addition to this i would also take the i5 recommendations into consideration but again that is completely up to you as you simply asked fro which gpu(s), In conclusion I would say grab to 390's. Also please research HBM memory the r9 fury comes with 4gb HBM, and im not entirely sure if its the same as Gddr5 memory, sorry i cant help you there

[Ramontes]

Wow. was not expecting that many replies in such a short of time. my budget is $1,500, and most of it is towards a new monitor (Freesync 1440p) and stuff i need to replace. my gaming mouse died on me and a new case cause its awful in airflow. So from what i hear is don't get 2 390's get 1 390x and get an i5.. I completly agree that my 8350 is getting a little long in the tooth but it hasn't bottlenecked me yet in any of my gaming.

yeah the cpu choice is totally up to you, it should hold up fine to be honset and why the 390x? i thought it only came with extra shaders(dont quote me im not 100% sure)

[Ramontes]

also he already has 16gb ram, so i would assume he doesnt want to go past ddr3 memory so if it is an i5 4690k is the way to go or just stay on the amd proccesor

[SkilledRebuilds]

Why i5 over 8350,..Intel's IPC makes up a lot for the lower amount of cores compared to the FX in a multipurpose rig.

 

Even multithreaded works ON a gaming priority rig, the 8350 is not in the lead ENOUGH that it makes me wanna get one over an i5 for a gaming rig.

 

 

Thats before you even mention games...

In GPU heavy situations thats all well and good but with Crossfire you'll be pumping more frames out in general, and need decent CPU strength (not core count) to not impose limitations on that.

[Ramontes]

Intel's IPC makes up a lot for the lower amount of cores compared to the FX in a multipurpose rig.

 

Even multithreaded works ON a gaming priority rig, the 8350 is not in the lead ENOUGH that it makes me wanna get one over an i5 for a gaming rig.

 

 

Thats before you even mention games...

i think we should focus on his question about the gpu's first 

[Aniallation]

if you really want the 300 series tho i heard that you can "unlock" some of those cards to become a full fury x

Fury can be unlocked into Fury X, not 390.

[SkilledRebuilds]

i think we should focus on his question about the gpu's first 

Yeah, but I wanted to actually point out the 'thought', that the 8350 multithreaded load, isn't THAT much far ahead of the 5th gen i5's (esp overclocked) for most gamers buy the priority of gaming rigs first, encoding/productivity jobs second.

 

IMO, More powerful Single GPU over dual, but if I myself had a choice here, it would be 2x 290's until the Fury X-Successor comes out.

2x 290's for Price>Performance.

Or Single FuryX

[Aniallation]

And yes, you will want to upgrade your CPU because even a single 390 will be bottlenecked by an FX8. Take a look at my writeup on the matters:

 

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/401217-more-updated-fx-vs-intel-for-gaming/

 

Simple conclusions - Why Intel i3/i5 are better for gaming then competing AMD FX:
 
- Generally better gaming performance (see below)
- Lower power consumption
- Lower heat output, heat output that the stock cooler can actually handle, eliminating the need for an aftermarket cooler for a quiet PC
- Upgradability: Buy an i3 now and upgrade to a massively more powerful i7 later while keeping the same motherboard. Buy an FX8 now, and be stuck with it until next mobo upgrade
- Greater motherboard selection, no need for fancy VRMs (see below)
- More modern technologies: PCIe 3.0, native USB 3.0/3.1, on-die integrated graphics (in case of GPU failure, can keep using your PC), etc
 
- Better IPC: Every MHz does more with Intel.
 
More cores does not mean better, if you can't use all of them. Intel cores are not twice as powerful as FX cores (given at stock), but if you can only use half of the cores on your FX then what's the point of having so many?

 

And before people think it, there is no bias here, I am an AMD CPU user. I don't regret my purchase because I did it back in the day when AMD was still highly competitive with Intel's first-gen Core-i CPUs, but here today, I'm just giving cold hard facts.
 
Gaming performance

Grand Theft Auto V
 

 
FX6 and FX8 fall between i3 and i5
 
The Witcher 3
 

 
FX6 and FX8 fall behind respective i3 and i5
 
Call of Duty: Advanced Warfare
 

 
A game optimized pretty darn well for multi-threaded CPUs, still can't see the FX8 pull away from i5
 
Batman Arkham Knight
 

 
Even the top-of-the-line FX 9590 can't catch up to i3
 
Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes
 

 
Lowest-end i3 can compete with FX, but even a 0.4GHz higher model and Intel starts to pull away
 
Project CARS
 

 
Once again FX6 and FX8 falling behind respective i3 and i5

 

Far Cry 4

 

 

I'm sure you can see the pattern here
 

If you note in some of these benchmarks, sometimes FX4 is actually ahead of FX6, because it is running at a higher frequency on each of the cores. These are examples of poor multi-threaded optimization in games. Many AAA titles still can't use more then 4 cores, so 4 FX cores at 3.8GHz is better then 6 FX cores at 3.5GHz.
 
VRMs - what are they and why are they important:
 

When talking about AM3+ boards you'll often hear the term VRMs. These are Voltage Regulation Modules, they are what turn the PSU's 12V into the ~1.4V (FX) your CPU will take. So the higher the power draw of your CPU, the more work the VRMs have to do. On Intel boards this isn't a big deal because at stock speeds you won't see more then 88W of CPU TDP, but you can't trust these same VRMs with the 125W FX chips. Overloading motherboard VRMs can actually lead to them burning out, causing a dead motherboard and possibly a fire hazard.
 
Read more about VRMs: http://www.overclock.net/a/about-vrms-mosfets-motherboard-safety-with-high-tdp-processors

 
Price:
(This is where the text comes in so get your English and math comprehension skills ready)
 

 

People think that FX is cheaper, and therefore is better for the money, and they'd be willing to make that sacrifice in performance for a bit of sacrifice in cost, but in reality, the difference is negligible. Take a look at these comparisons. Again this continues on the fact that you'll want a board with good VRMs for reliability on AM3+, while it's pretty much whatever with locked Intel chips. For this reason we'll be comparing using probably the best "cheap" AM3+ board, the Gigabyte GA-970A-UD3P, with it's 8+2 phase VRMs, compared to a budget Intel H97 board.
 
FX-6300 vs i3

 
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-6300 3.5GHz 6-Core Processor  ($96.88 @ OutletPC) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-970A-UD3P ATX AM3+ Motherboard  ($79.98 @ OutletPC) 
Total: $176.86
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-05 19:59 EDT-0400
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i3-4160 3.6GHz Dual-Core Processor  ($108.95 @ SuperBiiz) 
Motherboard: ASRock H97M Anniversary Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  ($64.89 @ OutletPC) 
Total: $173.84
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-05 20:01 EDT-0400


 
$3 cheaper for the i3, and keep in mind as we proved above, the i3s are more then capable of competing with FX8 and even FX9 chips, only in the worst case scenario being around the same as FX6. On top of that, the benefits of Intel as listed above.
 
FX-8320 vs i5

 
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-8320 3.5GHz 8-Core Processor  ($134.99 @ Amazon) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-970A-UD3P ATX AM3+ Motherboard  ($79.98 @ OutletPC) 
Total: $214.97
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-05 20:03 EDT-0400
 
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i5-4460 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor  ($166.95 @ SuperBiiz) 
Motherboard: ASRock H97M Anniversary Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  ($64.89 @ OutletPC) 
Total: $231.84
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-05 20:04 EDT-0400
 

 
$17 more for the i5, for much higher performance and pretty much zero bottleneck with any single GPU in any game, as opposed to the struggling FX...
 
Cooler
 
Do note that these builds are NOT with an aftermarket cooler. While the stock Intel coolers are fine for their accompanying chips, the coolers bundled with 125W FX chips aren't really up to the job, and can become VERY loud under load. If you want a quiet PC you'll want to invest in an aftermarket cooler. The cheapest one worth buying to quiet down an FX chip is the Zalman CNPS5X, which is $17. 
 
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/zalman-cpu-cooler-cnps5xperforma
 
This eliminates the price gap between the FX8 and i5, and makes the i3 choice $20 cheaper then the FX6 choice.
 
But what if I don't live in the USA?
 

 
Canada
 

 
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-6300 3.5GHz 6-Core Processor  ($122.99 @ NCIX) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-970A-UD3P ATX AM3+ Motherboard  ($109.75 @ Vuugo) 
Total: $232.74
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-05 20:12 EDT-0400
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i3-4160 3.6GHz Dual-Core Processor  ($136.50 @ shopRBC) 
Motherboard: ASRock H97M Anniversary Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  ($93.98 @ Newegg Canada) 
Total: $230.48
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-05 20:12 EDT-0400
 
 
 
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-8320 3.5GHz 8-Core Processor  ($169.75 @ Vuugo) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-970A-UD3P ATX AM3+ Motherboard  ($109.75 @ Vuugo) 
Total: $279.50
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-05 20:35 EDT-0400
 
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i5-4440 3.1GHz Quad-Core Processor  ($225.00 @ Vuugo) 
Motherboard: MSI H81M-E34 Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  ($66.00 @ Vuugo) 
Total: $291.00
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-05 20:14 EDT-0400

 
UK
 

 
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-6300 3.5GHz 6-Core Processor  (£79.19 @ Aria PC) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-970A-UD3P ATX AM3+ Motherboard  (£64.54 @ More Computers) 
Total: £143.73
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 01:14 BST+0100
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i3-4160 3.6GHz Dual-Core Processor  (£84.53 @ Ebuyer) 
Motherboard: ASRock H97M Anniversary Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  (£69.47 @ Amazon UK) 
Total: £154.00
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 01:14 BST+0100
 
 
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-8320 3.5GHz 8-Core Processor  (£108.13 @ CCL Computers) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-970A-UD3P ATX AM3+ Motherboard  (£64.54 @ More Computers) 
Total: £172.67
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 01:15 BST+0100
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i5-4440 3.1GHz Quad-Core Processor  (£137.36 @ Ebuyer) 
Motherboard: MSI H81M-E34 Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  (£34.68 @ CCL Computers) 
Total: £172.04
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 01:15 BST+0100
 

 

Kangaroo Land
 

 
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-6300 3.5GHz 6-Core Processor  ($145.00 @ CPL Online) 
Motherboard: MSI 970 GAMING ATX AM3+ Motherboard  ($145.00 @ CPL Online) 
Total: $290.00
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 10:25 AEST+1000
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i3-4160 3.6GHz Dual-Core Processor  ($152.00 @ CPL Online) 
Motherboard: ASRock H97M Anniversary Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  ($99.00 @ IJK) 
Total: $251.00
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 10:26 AEST+1000
 
 
 
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-8320 3.5GHz 8-Core Processor  ($205.00 @ CPL Online) 
Motherboard: MSI 970 GAMING ATX AM3+ Motherboard  ($145.00 @ CPL Online) 
Total: $350.00
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 10:25 AEST+1000
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i5-4460 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor  ($246.00 @ Centre Com) 
Motherboard: ASRock H97M Anniversary Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  ($99.00 @ IJK) 
Total: $345.00
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 10:26 AEST+1000
 

​Deutschland
 

 
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-6300 3.5GHz 6-Core Processor  (€99.90 @ Caseking) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-970A-UD3P ATX AM3+ Motherboard  (€85.09 @ Amazon Deutschland) 
Total: €184.99
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 02:23 CEST+0200
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i3-4160 3.6GHz Dual-Core Processor  (€119.95 @ Amazon Deutschland) 
Motherboard: ASRock H97M Anniversary Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  (€76.89 @ Amazon Deutschland) 
Total: €196.84
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 02:23 CEST+0200
 
 
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: AMD FX-8320 3.5GHz 8-Core Processor  (€139.90 @ Caseking) 
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-970A-UD3P ATX AM3+ Motherboard  (€85.09 @ Amazon Deutschland) 
Total: €224.99
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 02:23 CEST+0200
 

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant
 
CPU: Intel Core i5-4440 3.1GHz Quad-Core Processor  (€189.90 @ Caseking) 
Motherboard: MSI H81M-E34 Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard  (€56.18 @ Amazon Deutschland) 
Total: €246.08
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-07-06 02:23 CEST+0200
 

 

(more to be added)
 
Around the world the price differences do change and often the gap grows but there is never a point where the Intel option is "overpriced" compared to Intel, considering the performance you get.