Are the people at HP high....?

[Principis]

I have seen worse with HP

Carey Holzman nice that you know his channel

[MuffinTopMike]

If you don't want to participate in the discussion then stop posting, it's as simple as that. I am not the one posting stuff then complaining about being tagged.  :rolleyes:

 

You must watch his videos through rose colored glasses if you believe half of that.

 

 

I don't know what experience you have had with centrecom, but to claim HP have worse support is kind off erroneous because you don't have to go through HP with a warranty claim, you can go back to the shop you bought it from. I personally wouldn't touch centrecom for love nor money and probably for the same reason you don't like HP. i.e Personal experience.   But this is my point, the HP unit is available in office works for 398 with a monitor, keyboard and mouse,  sure you get a better cpu with the centrcom unit but by the time you add the rest the average customer (who won't even notice the difference between cpus) would be better of with the office works deal. 

 

 

pretty much my point in all this thread.  The people these systems are aimed at don't know about small shops, which end of a screwdriver to hold, where windows comes from or what websites to avoid.  They just need to go into one shop they know will be there tomorrow and by a complete system that works out of the box.

To be honest your argument has just reached the point of making assumptions about people who buy those types of computers. The original argument was, that at the $300-350 price point that those budget HP computers are the best value for money in terms of quality and performance. Members like @ proved that HP computers have a pretty poor track recorded in terms of reliability. Carey in his second video, and other members posted possible PC builds which were much cheaper than the HP and overall would have performed better, but then you said most consumers have no interest in building their own computer, which is a fair point. But then when I posted that Centre Com computer, which would be more reliable and perform better, you assumed that consumers wouldn't notice the difference between the performance of the two, and you assumed the average consumer has never heard of Centre Com, or would ever research about computers before they buy. So now the argument has turned into "Which computer is best if you only have $350 to spend and you have only heard of one computer brand, which is HP." 

[mr moose]

To be honest your argument has just reached the point of making assumptions about people who buy those types of computers. The original argument was, that at the $300-350 price point that those budget HP computers are the best value for money in terms of quality and performance. Members like @ proved that HP computers have a pretty poor track recorded in terms of reliability. Carey in his second video, and other members posted possible PC builds which were much cheaper than the HP and overall would have performed better, but then you said most consumers have no interest in building their own computer, which is a fair point. But then when I posted that Centre Com computer, which would be more reliable and perform better, you assumed that consumers wouldn't notice the difference between the performance of the two, and you assumed the average consumer has never heard of Centre Com, or would ever research about computers before they buy. So now the argument has turned into "Which computer is best if you only have $350 to spend and you have only heard of one computer brand, which is HP."

No, he's a moron. He claims screw choice on a pc that is not supposed to be opened by the consumer is somehow a design flaw. Really? he just hates on HP because it's click bait and so many uneducated people lap it up. There is another thread on here somewhere that explains all the issues with his videos and why he's not that good.

The pc that he is bashing is not a power pc, it is not supposed to be anything he claims it is. It is a cheap solution for emails, word processing and web surfing snf nothing else, which renders most of his complaints moot.

EDIT: found the thread, has some good discussion and information on carey, the HP in question and discussion regarding the issues between him and Linus.

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/194602-carey-holzman-says-some-stuff-about-ltt/

 

I don't believe my argument has changed, I still maintain the the HP unit is aimed at entry level and that majority of the people who buy it will have never considered building their own. I think it's quite a fair appraisal to say that not only is the centrecom computer more expensive when you add a monitor keyboard and mouse, but that majority of lay people haven't heard of centrecom.  Especially not when compared to office works.

 

Also I think you will find that claiming the centrecom unit to be more reliable is an assumption. It is not which brand you have heard of, but which shop are you more likely to know and trust.  I am sorry but a centrecom versus officeworks for the average joe with little knowledge about computers, most people will trust a large chain before they trust a small shop. Proof: that's why harvey norman still exists while shops like centrcom come and go.   

[Dabombinable]

 

I don't believe my argument has changed, I still maintain the the HP unit is aimed at entry level and that majority of the people who buy it will have never considered building their own. I think it's quite a fair appraisal to say that not only is the centrecom computer more expensive when you add a monitor keyboard and mouse, but that majority of lay people haven't heard of centrecom.  Especially not when compared to office works.

 

Also I think you will find that claiming the centrecom unit to be more reliable is an assumption. It is not which brand you have heard of, but which shop are you more likely to know and trust.  I am sorry but a centrecom versus officeworks for the average joe with little knowledge about computers, most people will trust a large chain before they trust a small shop. Proof: that's why harvey norman still exists while shops like centrcom come and go.   

Don't get me started on Harvey Norman, my local one is being run by a manager who can't even operate a register.

[mr moose]

Don't get me started on Harvey Norman, my local one is being run by a manager who can't even operate a register.

so bad isn't it.  There is nothing worse than being stuck with the option, pay the inflated price and get it now at HN or wait a few weeks until you are in the city again and get it a respectable price.

[MuffinTopMike]

 

I don't believe my argument has changed, I still maintain the the HP unit is aimed at entry level and that majority of the people who buy it will have never considered building their own. I think it's quite a fair appraisal to say that not only is the centrecom computer more expensive when you add a monitor keyboard and mouse, but that majority of lay people haven't heard of centrecom.  Especially not when compared to office works.

 

Also I think you will find that claiming the centrecom unit to be more reliable is an assumption. It is not which brand you have heard of, but which shop are you more likely to know and trust.  I am sorry but a centrecom versus officeworks for the average joe with little knowledge about computers, most people will trust a large chain before they trust a small shop. Proof: that's why harvey norman still exists while shops like centrcom come and go.   

Well first of all Centre Com isn't a store that comes and goes, I mean its been around for almost 17 years. If the person looking for a cheap computer goes to Officeworks, then yes, the HP is the best computer for $400, well because it is the only computer Officeworks sells at that price point. In terms of price, performance and quality, the HP is terrible and there are plenty of better option available, whether that looking for a computer from another major brand with a better track record, like Dell, or buying a system that has been built in store, like the Centre Com ones.

[mr moose]

Well first of all Centre Com isn't a store that comes and goes, I mean its been around for almost 17 years. If the person looking for a cheap computer goes to Officeworks, then yes, the HP is the best computer for $400, well because it is the only computer Officeworks sells at that price point. In terms of price, performance and quality, the HP is terrible and there are plenty of better option available, whether that looking for a computer from another major brand with a better track record, like Dell, or buying a system that has been built in store, like the Centre Com ones.

 

So has MSY and CPL, I believe pccasegear have been around for quite some time too,  but you know what?  we enthusiasts who are most frequenters of said shops only make up a small portion of the pc buying public.  

 

To be honest I don't know why this is so hard for people to accept/understand.  there is a whole world that operates on a totally different level to us enthusiasts, our little bubble of knowledge only really applies to us, our desire for the best at the best price is something our interest affords us. For everyone else they require more support and less things to think about.

 

Sure they could buy the unit from centrecom, but they would still have to get a monitor, keyboard and mouse which will make it more expensive, they will have to learn how to create some sort of backup disc because the centrecom pc doesn't come with backup software or a windows cd, only a pre imaged hdd and a windows key, plus they will not have 24/7 phone support.   So you really think they are getting a better deal by buying that whitebox?  Remember the target demographic is not tech savvy,  creating a backup solution is not easy, sorting out any issues without phone support isn't easy. 

[MuffinTopMike]

So has MSY and CPL, I believe pccasegear have been around for quite some time too,  but you know what?  we enthusiasts who are most frequenters of said shops only make up a small portion of the pc buying public.  

 

To be honest I don't know why this is so hard for people to accept/understand.  there is a whole world that operates on a totally different level to us enthusiasts, our little bubble of knowledge only really applies to us, our desire for the best at the best price is something our interest affords us. For everyone else they require more support and less things to think about.

 

Sure they could buy the unit from centrecom, but they would still have to get a monitor, keyboard and mouse which will make it more expensive, they will have to learn how to create some sort of backup disc because the centrecom pc doesn't come with backup software or a windows cd, only a pre imaged hdd and a windows key, plus they will not have 24/7 phone support.   So you really think they are getting a better deal by buying that whitebox?  Remember the target demographic is not tech savvy,  creating a backup solution is not easy, sorting out any issues without phone support isn't easy. 

Well, it is in the interests of all consumers to get the best product at the best price, not just in the interests of enthusiasts. Also I don't think most average consumers know about backup discs or care if the computer comes with the Windows CD. Remember these are the same people who you said wouldn't notice the difference between the performance of two, pretty different systems. And in terms of support, well if it is a software problem you can always get support through Microsoft, and if its a hardware problem, well there aren't many hardware problems that can be solved over the phone. I think people would prefer taking the computer into a store close by, instead of talking to a support center in a country thousands of kilometers away.

[mr moose]

Also I don't think most average consumers know about backup discs or care if the computer comes with the Windows CD.

 

They'll care when the phone support (if they have any) says "you need to get your pc restore discs" and the customers asks "what are they?".

 

And in terms of support, well if it is a software problem you can always get support through Microsoft, and if its a hardware problem, well there aren't many hardware problems that can be solved over the phone.

 

except that you don't get hardware phone support with the whitebox, and you only get limited phone support (if any) with OEM from MS. At least with HP if you have a problem you can talk to someone at 2am who will explain how to send it back to the factory for repair/replacement.  Also MS are not going to help with hardware or third party software.  

 

 

 I think people would prefer taking the computer into a store close by, instead of talking to a support center in a country thousands of kilometers away.

 

Which is easier to do considering there are more office works stores than there are centrcom/small pc outlets.

 

 

So so far this is what we have:

 

Centrecom white box:

 

Pros: better cpu. marginally cheaper for the better cpu.

 

Cons:

just the box,  return to shop during business hours for hardware support minimal software support (if any).

 

Statistically less stable according MS hardware survey.

 

User has no rescue software or windows cd option at purchase.

 

user has to purchase monitor and peripherals separately.

 

Officeworks HP:

 

Cons:  less powerful CPU, maybe marginally more expensive for the processing power you get.

 

Pro's:

 

24/7 phone support,  return to base or mail in hardware support,  option to burn rescue discs from preinstalled software.

statistically more stable according to MS hardware survey. 

 

 

Just because we don't like HP doesn't mean their entry level gear doesn't fill an otherwise empty niche.

 

I can see a small portion of people getting a better deal out of the centrcom unit, but in reality the HP unit caters to a wider array of consumers and has many more supporting features.

[Geralt]

The only thing I've owned that's HP and still actually works is the Pavillion w1907 monitor that still works till today. Currently using it as my second screen. Other than that, just no.

[Tiby]

Well you do get what you paid for, and in this case is for the company name. 

HP is still doing very well in the corporate environment where not everybody is technical literate and the IT department is so much overloaded with other stuff that building workstations (mind you not one but hundreds) is simply not possible.

Even some of my friends run far away from the ideea of "let me help you build your computer" because they simply want something that just runs without them touching anything. 

If something goes bad they simply return it and order something new.

To each with its own.

[NumLock21]

If there were 2 HP models one with a dedicated GPU like the one in the OP and the other without, I'll rather pick the one that has so I know it has a PCIe x16 slot. Forgot was it Dell or HP that some models are so cheap, where you select the one without a dedicated GPU, they won't even bother installing a physical x16 slot onto the motherboard.

[iHardware Shelden]

This I why I like Dell... BTX was an even better idea then all of this.

[iHardware Shelden]

Carey Holzman nice that you know his channel

Who doesn't know Carey?

[gergy008]

As someone with a Pavilion: Yes, someone must have been high while designing HP PC's. Some of the designs are abstract and cool, while others are crap and "less than ideal".

 

Irony

[Fgtfv567]

Irony

God, I hope she was being sarcastic..

[VirtualR3ality]

God, I hope she was being sarcastic..

If not kill it with fire and bash her with a HP printer. 

[pxystus545]

a

[QueenDemetria]

Irony

Lol

 

God, I hope she was being sarcastic..

Yep, that's why I have the ... . The full sentence is "HP's are great once you swap the motherboard, power supply, change the cooing, and cut a hole in the front of the case.". My HP is a good computer now

 

If not kill it with fire and bash her with a HP printer. 

Lol, no need to do that.

[G33k 4 L1F3]

I literally just made a $400 build that does 100 times better then this piece of crap. Honestly they might have been doing some shots, or 420 blazing while thinking this up.

[t895]

A friend of mine owns the HP 110-210 and is struggling to do anything involving gaming. When I first talked to him about getting it, I deeply regretted it the night after seeing that video. We were going to get him a graphics card and everything would work fine, but then I saw that it didn't have the option on the board as well as the PSU and the PCI expansion slots being sealed off COMPLETELY. It was a sad, sad day. However, he is now saving up to build a PC of his own to replace that over-sized calculator.

[uykh]

I have a HP Laptop and ohboy imma tell you a story.

 

The USB 3.0 port is not blue and I didnt know there was a 3.0 port until i did some reseach, fine job HP

My ethernet port is too big for a stick, like a tiny bit so it always disconnects.

their power stick or whatever it so damm thin and feels like it breaks easily.

I updated my drivers though HPs own program, guess what happened, it fucked itself up.

 

though else everything is fine, but I wouldnt be wondering if they were smokin' somthing they werent supposed to.

[Fgtfv567]

A friend of mine owns the HP 110-210 and is struggling to do anything involving gaming. When I first talked to him about getting it, I deeply regretted it the night after seeing that video. We were going to get him a graphics card and everything would work fine, but then I saw that it didn't have the option on the board as well as the PSU and the PCI expansion slots being sealed off COMPLETELY. It was a sad, sad day. However, he is now saving up to build a PC of his own to replace that over-sized calculator.

OH GOD. OH MY GOD. I WOULDN'T WISH THAT GOD-AWFUL TURD ON MY ENEMIES! (Ok, yes I would...) BUT YOU AND YOUR FRIEND HAVE MY MOST SINCEREST APOLOGIES.

[t895]

OH GOD. OH MY GOD. I WOULDN'T WISH THAT GOD-AWFUL TURD ON MY ENEMIES! (Ok, yes I would...) BUT YOU AND YOUR FRIEND HAVE MY MOST SINCEREST APOLOGIES.

It was an accident, he had a really tight budget and his parents didn't allow me or him to build a PC.

[mr moose]

It was an accident, he had a really tight budget and his parents didn't allow me or him to build a PC.

Dare I say it, not an accident, but poor parenting.  A little research might have gone a long way on the part of he parents.