Intel ‘Skylake’ processors for PCs will not support AVX-512 instructions

[Rohith_Kumar_Sp]

Intel Corp.’s forthcoming central processing units code-named “Skylake” for personal computers will not support any AVX-512 instructions, according to a media report. Only Xeon processors for servers and, possibly, workstations will support 512-bit instructions.
 

Support of 512-bit SIMD instructions – known as AVX3 – was expected to be a key feature of Intel “Skylake” processors, which would help the chips to demonstrate extremely high performance in applications that take advantage of the innovation. However, Intel decided not to enable any AVX-512 instructions in consumer versions of the code-named “Skylake” processors, reports Bits & Chips web-site. While future Xeon chips that belong to the “Skylake” generation will support select AVX-512 instructions. Apparently, even Xeon processors featuring the new cores will not support certain 512-bit instructions supported by Xeon Phi “Knights Landing” co-processors.
 

 

As it turns out, only “Cannonlake” processors due in late 2016 or early 2017 will support most AVX-512 instructions, but not all of them. It is also unclear whether consumer versions of “Cannonlake” CPUs will have comprehensive support of 512-bit instructions.
 

 

Several years ago it was reported that Intel Xeon processors with “Skylake” micro-architecture will support AVX 3.2 technology with 512-bit instructions. Intel Xeon Phi “Knights Landing” is expected to support AVX 3.1 instructions.
 

 

While 512-bit instructions will be useful for high-performance computing applications, in client PCs they could improve performance of demanding multimedia applications. Exclusion of AVX-512 support from consumer processors will slowdown adoption of the new instructions by software developers. In fact, without AVX 3.2 the new “Skylake” processors will bring almost no innovations compared to “Haswell” and “Broadwell” chips from instruction-set point of view.

Intel did not comment on the news-story.

Source : http://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/anton-shilov/intel-skylake-processors-for-pcs-will-not-support-avx-512-instructions/

OP : Is intel really holding back for AMD ? or is it due to intel thinking of chaining silicon manufacturing ? either way skylake really doesn't have much improvements over haswell/broadwell. 

[Syntaxvgm]

Oh fucking come on intel. So I have to buy a locked CPU to get access to every instruction set? Either start selling unlocked xeons (they are binned really well, so that would be cool, and it's not like you HAVE to if you are looking for a stable machine) or stop doing shit like this.

[Opcode]

Already stated this months ago...

[Fulgrim]

AMD are planning for AVX 512 with Zen, supposedly.

 

http://www.kitguru.net/components/cpu/anton-shilov/amds-zen-could-sport-intels-skylake-technologies-new-512-bit-fpu-rumours/

[deviant88]

Oh fucking come on intel. So I have to buy a locked CPU to get access to every instruction set? Either start selling unlocked xeons (they are binned really well, so that would be cool, and it's not like you HAVE to if you are looking for a stable machine) or stop doing shit like this.

 

Well intel's marketing cant do much about it but my problem is AVX sounds like something great ever since it was introduces but why no programs use it? if the AVX work is more scientific/server relevant then i dont care at all,curently haswell has AVX 2 256 bit i think so what scenario or app takes advantage of this on windows ,cause games sure dont.There was only one game by codemasters that had AVX .exe and it showed no benefit in my benchmark tests.

[ArM]

Intel start to really suck, how can they think people who bought a product with no innovation.

 

Since Sandy except graphic performance what they really enhanced, oh yes the power consumption LOL

[VerticalDiscussions]

Aufff, why is Intel removing special features in theyr future chipsets, and AMD only makes promises, and yet nothing comes up -.-? The computer industry right now is very slowly showing up.

[qwertywarrior]

there must be a valid reason for this and not just because its "a pro feature"

 

we will wait and see

[Kamina]

Aufff, why is Intel removing special features in theyr future chipsets, and AMD only makes promises, and yet nothing comes up -.-? The computer industry right now is very slowly showing up.

 

A dawn of a new age is arising. I guess Silicon is at its end times. Gotta prolong the inevitable. 

[patrickjp93]

Intel start to really suck, how can they think people who bought a product with no innovation.

 

Since Sandy except graphic performance what they really enhanced, oh yes the power consumption LOL

If you have properly tuned software, there's a 65+% gap between SB and HW. The problem right now is legacy support in software and using crappy compilers like Microsoft's which barely find ways to use parallel instructions such as SSE and AVX.

 

Base and boost clocks have also seen large improvements since SB. Only enthusiast overclockers who reached 4.8+GHz on their 2600K don't see this. I'm sick and tired of ignorant people shooting off at the mouth. Intel has pushed legacy software performance about as far as it's going to go. No instruction can execute less than a single cycle, so old software running on SISD models of computing will not get much better beyond SB for IPC. At that point it has to be parallel instructions, multithreading, or pushing clock rates. Intel has not been sitting on its tail end. Software devs have.

[patrickjp93]

there must be a valid reason for this and not just because its "a pro feature"

 

we will wait and see

You mean like: it's pointless because most consumer software doesn't even use AVX 1.0 and stagnated with Windows 7?

[ArM]

If you have properly tuned software, there's a 65+% gap between SB and HW. The problem right now is legacy support in software and using crappy compilers like Microsoft's which barely find ways to use parallel instructions such as SSE and AVX.

 

Base and boost clocks have also seen large improvements since SB. Only enthusiast overclockers who reached 4.8+GHz on their 2600K don't see this. I'm sick and tired of ignorant people shooting off at the mouth. Intel has pushed legacy software performance about as far as it's going to go. No instruction can execute less than a single cycle, so old software running on SISD models of computing will not get much better beyond SB for IPC. At that point it has to be parallel instructions, multithreading, or pushing clock rates. Intel has not been sitting on its tail end. Software devs have.

Surely it's also one of the must processors innovate company but does it justify to stop it and sell product with no longer real innovation.

 

You blame software devs but what do you think as you say they're sitting at tail end?? 

 

Cause every year a (new) processor gen come so how can they focus on the actual gen when they already think of the next who much probably perform better...

 

The problem is just here and Intel like many companies just start to pay there race on there obsolete one year business model.

[Hatsune Miku 「 」]

I'm sad. I was looking forward to it.

[CatCloud]

What about Skylake-E ????????????

im guessing they have it because "Only Xeon processors for servers and, possibly, workstations will support 512-bit instructions"

[patrickjp93]

Surely it's also one of the must processors innovate company but does it justify to stop it and sell product with no longer real innovation.

 

You blame software devs but what do you think as you say they're sitting at tail end?? 

 

Cause every year a (new) processor gen come so how can they focus on the actual gen when they already think of the next who much probably perform better...

 

The problem is just here and Intel like many companies just start to pay there race on there obsolete one year business model.

They are sitting on their butts. Most college junior computer science majors can code better than the old guard lead devs, and the lead devs are forcing legacy support in the name of having the widest possible user base instead of putting any effort into multiple code paths to at least let those with newer processors see a real advantage as is their due.

 

They can focus on what became available in the last 3 years. The main problem is software being stuck in SISD mode because Windows 7 is built to be compatible with everything going back to the Core 2 days.

 

You also can't develop for instructions which don't exist yet, so I don't understand your 3rd statement at all.

 

The problem isn't Intel. Intel has put down all the tools in front of software makers. It's up to them to pick those tools up. It's the same reason you don't see more than 4 CPU cores on the mainstream chips. There's absolutely no current use for them or any significant demand. The software just isn't there mainstream, and professionals are willing to pay more for more cores, especially when AMD is floundering about like it is.

[patrickjp93]

What about Skylake-E ????????????

im guessing they have it because "Only Xeon processors for servers and, possibly, workstations will support 512-bit instructions"

Most workstations use E3 or E5 Xeons so... 99% likely AVX 512 WON'T come to Skylake-E.

[Opcode]

there must be a valid reason for this and not just because its "a pro feature"

 

we will wait and see

Pointless to release AVX-512 on the consumer market. Most standard software today doesn't make use of any of the AVX instructions because they are not needed.

[Brawhammer]

Pointless to release AVX-512 on the consumer market. Most standard software today doesn't make use of any of the AVX instructions because they are not needed.

 

Not needed now. But what about the future?

[Opcode]

Not needed now. But what about the future?

AVX-512 could be put to use in some places of the software industry. A prime example is FFmpeg leverages AVX for its decoding. Other CPU heavy software might seek some advantages from using much wider SIMD as well. Tho with most standard software you would never even notice the difference. A prime example being something like CCleaner or my software in my signature. Neither would see any noticeable performance gains from leveraging AVX instructions. The places where these instructions shine is when large or time critical workloads are involved. Tho not every consumer runs an AVX enabled microprocessor as well so until the adoption rate goes up of newer hardware its also not logical for all software to solely depend on them. The only way around this is to write your functions entirely by hand to either leverage AVX or SSE. From there you can just check if the user is running an AVX enabled microprocessor like this and execute the function that corresponds with hardware support.

MOV EAX, 1CPUIDAND ECX, 018000000hCMP ECX, 018000000hJNE <Not Supported>MOV ECX, 0XGETBVAND EAX, 06hMOV [<Variable>], EAX

Or provide two different builds for the consumer (one new and one legacy).

[ArM]

They are sitting on their butts. Most college junior computer science majors can code better than the old guard lead devs, and the lead devs are forcing legacy support in the name of having the widest possible user base instead of putting any effort into multiple code paths to at least let those with newer processors see a real advantage as is their due.

 

They can focus on what became available in the last 3 years. The main problem is software being stuck in SISD mode because Windows 7 is built to be compatible with everything going back to the Core 2 days.

 

You also can't develop for instructions which don't exist yet, so I don't understand your 3rd statement at all.

 

The problem isn't Intel. Intel has put down all the tools in front of software makers. It's up to them to pick those tools up. It's the same reason you don't see more than 4 CPU cores on the mainstream chips. There's absolutely no current use for them or any significant demand. The software just isn't there mainstream, and professionals are willing to pay more for more cores, especially when AMD is floundering about like it is.

Yeah It's logical of course if you don't have the tools you can't do anything.

 

But the big problem is they put down tools in front of devs too fast even new devs are gonna be out one day if they don't slow down that's why I say there is no real innovation cause where is the innovation when you put more & more new techs & tools that aren't gonna be use. It's just mean they did go wrong.

 

Too much innovation kill the innovation it's like all you got to found the rhythm or you gonna fail.

 

Old lead developers learned with old tools so it's normal that they don't really want to go back and begin at the start again, they know they couldn't stay eternally they did their times and they need to leave their place to the new generation it's just the life cycle.

 

So Intel really need to slow down the rhythm & much promote, encourage, focus & listen young developers to use the new instructions they made since last years & work or recruit more of them, focus more on there weakness like as you say Software to optimise what they actually did and stop focusing on making new unused tools.

 

I think that what they start to do by slow down the innovation and it's not wrong cause they really need to stop this crazy race and made more supplying to leave the time of the new develop to learn & exploit there new techs & made great new optimise Tools & Software.

[vm'N]

Not needed now. But what about the future?

Seen how much consumer software wont benefit anything past SSE2, I think we are a long way from that.

[Brawhammer]

Seen how much consumer software wont benefit anything past SSE2, I think we are a long way from that.

 

It's the year 2050 In order to get free GabenCare I need AVX-512 Instructions. Sadly I never upgraded during the CPU War and am stuck with a skylake processor that intel never thought I would need anything better.

 

Do you see my problem man? We need to save the future! For our kids!

 

Why won't someone think of the children!

[Legion495]

It's the year 2050 In order to get free GabenCare I need AVX-512 Instructions. Sadly I never upgraded during the CPU War and am stuck with a skylake processor that intel never thought I would need anything better.

 

Do you see my problem man? We need to save the future! For our kids!

 

Why won't someone think of the children!

 Yeah don't forget about our KIDS! 

But Intel whyyyy. I was going to get myself an Intel processor.

Is this still a good idea?  The future will show me that.

[vm'N]

nvm

[Blackie Sheen]

Intel start to really suck, how can they think people who bought a product with no innovation.

 

Since Sandy except graphic performance what they really enhanced, oh yes the power consumption LOL

 

Power consumpton is a big deal if you want to be able to be in a small enclosure. One of the build on the forum is using a 5930k and 980 sli in a 17,8 liter case consuming 515 watt at load which would not have been possible before. Plus, its important to mention that this build is working on a 600 watt sfx power supply