Linux Needs More Recognition From The Tech Community

[TetraSky]

I will care about Linux when all the latest games are also on Linux. It's getting better, but not enough. Until every new games has a linux version, it ain't worth switching, for me, just yet. Virtual Machine is not a solution.

[MEC-777]

I will care about Linux when all the latest games are also on Linux. It's getting better, but not enough. Until every new games has a linux version, it ain't worth switching, for me, just yet. Virtual Machine is not a solution.

 

That's part of the problem and partly why there aren't as many games that run native on Linux - because few people care about it yet. The more people use it, the more popular it will become and the more games will be made/ported for it. The more people use it, the better it will get. So by not using it, you're not helping to get it to where you want it to be.

 

Running windows in KVM is a solution that does work and that method actually carries with it other benefits for people who need to run/work with windows-exclusive programs. So don't dismiss that solution so lightly.   

[dfsdfgfkjsefoiqzemnd]

Instead of dual-booting windows/Linux, you can try this: https://teksyndicate.com/forum/linux/what-if-i-want-everything/157480

That's a neat one.  I'll probably give that a go on the next format (long overdue).  Just have to figure out first how it deals with dual screens and if I can assign an entire SSD to the Windows VM. 

With my current dualboot those things aren't a concern, but when I was dabbling with Virtualbox on Windows, that let me down in terms of dualscreen support. 

[VIhul]

As a complete Linux n00b but also wanting to learn more, I'd be interested in this kind of content. I'm in the same sort of privacy boat as Logan and Wendell and I'm skeptical about Cortana in Windows 10. Therefore, I want the knowledge for if/when I want to switch over to Linux.

[Dabombinable]

For those who say Windows is better for gaming, that's true but only because Microsoft had a campaign to get developers to use their proprietary DirectX instead of OpenGL, which Linux and OSX use. I only use Windows for games after all as Linux is able to run everything else.

[peanutsrevenge]

Yes it does, but I would reword it to "Linux deserves more recognition from the tech community". Just my opinion.
The rest was tl;dr

[MEC-777]

That's a neat one.  I'll probably give that a go on the next format (long overdue).  Just have to figure out first how it deals with dual screens and if I can assign an entire SSD to the Windows VM. 

With my current dualboot those things aren't a concern, but when I was dabbling with Virtualbox on Windows, that let me down in terms of dualscreen support. 

 

Virtualbox in windows is somewhat limited compared to running windows in KVM on Linux. You have far more options/capabilities with Linux as the host. I believe you can assign an entire SSD to the windows "container" (VM) which would definitely speed things up. 

 

As for multiple monitors, it helps to have multiple GPUs. You can use the integrated GPU if you run an Intel CPU that has it or an APU in combination with the discreet GPU. Then, you assign PCIe passthrough to the windows VM to the dGPU (for gaming) while the iGPU runs your host Linux OS. One display is connected to the iGPU and the other to the dGPU. Switching between the two is as simple as setting up a hotkey combination. If you only have one display, you can still do this. The only difference is you connect both the iGPU and dGPU to the display as separate inputs. You simply swap between inputs on your display and use the hotkey combo to switch between the windows VM and Linux. If you want to run dual screens from the windows VM, then you connect the dGPU to both screens and the iGPU to one of those two. Then you just switch the input on your screen that's hooked up to both. You maintain your windows productivity you need and gain the superior Linux file system used by the windows VM and can still use Linux as your main/host OS.

 

So while you can't [easily] use multiple displays in a Virtualbox VM on windows, you can do so in a KVM on Linux, along with other various options/combinations/possibilities. 

 

Many people see Linux as a somewhat "limited" platform/OS, but it's actually far more open and capable than windows ever was or ever will be. Linux allows you total control over your hardware without getting in the way. 

[Dabombinable]

Linux can "look" however you want it to look. It is 100% completely customizable in terms of visuals/GUI appearance and functionality. In that regard, nobody should even judge an OS based on layout and how it merely "looks". In this regard, Linux is vastly superior to windows.

 

Yes. You install windows on your Linux-hosted PC using KVM and PCIe pass-through. Within the VM you can significantly improve the way windows runs by killing many of the unecessary processes/services you don't need. If you understand the way this works, it can actually be better than running straight windows on bare metal. There's a lot more to it than that, but that's the basic premise and it does work. I'm building another PC to experiement with this later this year. At that time I'll create a build-log post on how all this works.

 

 

Again, there are ways around this... if you're willing to learn.

Plus if you know enough about it, you can go right ahead and build your own version from scratch (or base it off Debian, etc).

[Albatross]

If only it had more gaming, I'm sure it would climb in the popularity polls.  Good thing that is happening at a much faster rate recently.

 

As to your question, yes, I believe they (LMG) should. It would be very interesting to see them cover Linux in some way, and not superficially either.  This could help spread Linux to new users, as well.

[MEC-777]

If only it had more gaming, I'm sure it would climb in the popularity polls.  Good thing that is happening at a much faster rate recently.

 

As to your question, yes, I believe they (LMG) should. It would be very interesting to see them cover Linux in some way, and not superficially either.  This could help spread Linux to new users, as well.

 

If it climbs in popularity, it will gain a larger list of native games.  

 

The recent spike in new(er) games being ported/released with Linux support wasn't "just because", it's due to the rise in people using Linux (and because of SteamOS). So for those that choose not to use it because of lack of games supported, you're only slowing that progress. (not referring to you, specifically, Albatross) Too many people, I think, have that mentality and need to start thinking about it the other way around. The more people use it, the more games support we're going to get. 

[Albatross]

If it climbs in popularity, it will gain a larger list of native games.

 

The recent spike in new(er) games being ported/released with Linux support wasn't "just because", it's due to the rise in people using Linux (and because of SteamOS). So for those that choose not to use it because of lack of games supported, you're only slowing that progress. (not referring to you, specifically, Albatross) Too many people, I think, have that mentality and need to start thinking about it the other way around. The more people use it, the more games support we're going to get. 

 

True.

 

I game on it all the time (I don't use SteamOS, I use Ubuntu and Mint) and get stoked whenever I see someone say they are on Linux (mostly in Chivalry though). I actually turned a Skyrim player to Linux when I helped him install it via WINE. It was his only reason for sticking to Windows, since LibreOffice exists and a whole bunch of free video editing software too.

 

If people gave it an honest chance, they would see why it is such a great OS and why its potential is unprecedented. 

[ajoy39]

Over the past few years or so Linux was my daily driver, primarily because I am a web developer and that's much easier to do on a unix based system. Recently, I switched to OSX. It's better for my purposes even if I hate apple as a company. The OS as a whole is a lot harder to have that "god dammit I just fucked up my whole install and have to ground 0 this thing again" moment, and it has better program support. Linux was a pretty solid OS for me but honestly it's only benefit in my life over Windows was the Unix core, and I have that now.

So now I have a (company purchased) Macbook Pro retina that I use for work and most every day stuff (don't feel like firing up the gaming desktop just to browse the web or watch youtube for example) and then my gaming rig for games and some light video editing that I could probably do on the Mac, but choose to use the 8 core/OpenCL powerhouse desktop for.

All 3 OSes have their use cases and, as long as you're not paying for it yourself because damn these things are expensive for no reason, I tend to prefer OS X as my unix based system of choice. Linux/SteamOS currently runs my stream box so it's not out of my life but definitely plays a much smaller role. 

[ajoy39]

If only it had more gaming, I'm sure it would climb in the popularity polls.  Good thing that is happening at a much faster rate recently.

 

As to your question, yes, I believe they (LMG) should. It would be very interesting to see them cover Linux in some way, and not superficially either.  This could help spread Linux to new users, as well.

Yeah it really hasn't been. Steam Hardware survey actually had it losing market share in December and it's stayed steady at around 1.1% for years now. I do believe that Steam is pushing it though, probably offering some kind of incentive for porting to linux/steamOS, so maybe the users will follow if it continues to get decent support. 

[peanutsrevenge]

Who new channel: Slick'sNixTips (No, not Austin'sNipsTips)

Unfortunately, as I'm sure whoever's reading this knows, there's not a lot of viewership for Linux so there's not a lot of coverage of Linux which contributes to there not being much awareness of Linux leading to a lack of knowledge/interest from decent content creators because there's little viewership 
I'm dizzy

 

Anyway, I'd certainly like to see an iSwtiched from Linus. I reckon Linux is more likely to be dabbled with by the LTT viewers than OSX and shoving some Linux videos in people's sub boxes is a nice promotion especially when it's a tech focused audience.

How to do it though.
An iSwitch for 
Each major distro?
KDE/Gnome/Unity/CLI/Ice/Other?
Use paid apps or just free apps?


Maybe set up a laptop and let each staff member use it for a while (at home and/or none time sensitive stuff) showing how they found it useful/annoying after a few weeks.
Dunno. Linux is so flexible, it's hard to really pin down exactly what the experience is like to convey to a group of people who are used to Windoze.

[Dabombinable]

Who new channel: Slick'sNixTips (No, not Austin'sNipsTips)

Unfortunately, as I'm sure whoever's reading this knows, there's not a lot of viewership for Linux so there's not a lot of coverage of Linux which contributes to there not being much awareness of Linux leading to a lack of knowledge/interest from decent content creators because there's little viewership 

I'm dizzy

To be quite honest, Linux still isn't at the point where everyone can use it. A lot of the time to even install a program, you have to go through terminal for example. Not too many program developers use .deb or.rpm installers, preferring to rely on tarballs instead.

[ohJey]

That absolutely has to do with Linux being worse for gaming. Jack and Pepsi might taste better, but there's a reason bars serve Jack and coke. 

it's more a problem of not having enough games

Windows doesn't perform better in games

[MEC-777]

To be quite honest, Linux still isn't at the point where everyone can use it. A lot of the time to even install a program, you have to go through terminal for example. Not too many program developers use .deb or.rpm installers, preferring to rely on tarballs instead.

 

It is actually at that point, IMO. There are several distros currently available geared for the new user (Ubuntu/Mint etc.). Within those distros there is a "software center/manager" through which it makes finding and installing programs a breeze. The only time you need to use the terminal to install something is if it's not listed in the software manager app or not currently part of the repository list. Many of these more user-friendly distros already come pre-loaded with the more popular programs (LibreOffice, VLC player, Firefox, Thunderbird email client etc.) and/or they're available through the software manager app.

 

It's actually easier/safer than windows because if you're looking for a specific program to perform a particular type of task/function, with windows you have to scour the internet and hope you're downloading a safe program that's malware-free (hard to come by these days). With Linux, you fire up your software center and search the sub-categories where you know those programs will be safe and stable.

[peanutsrevenge]

To be quite honest, Linux still isn't at the point where everyone can use it. A lot of the time to even install a program, you have to go through terminal for example. Not too many program developers use .deb or.rpm installers, preferring to rely on tarballs instead.

Indeed there is, but I got dizzy so I stopped spinning. I'll continue for you though (if I throw up however, I'd like a nod of appreciation).

Due to a lack of awareness, there's a lack of Linux developers and software being ported to Linux with on the nerdiest sticking around, these 'nix nerds who are used to working in CLI write UIs that work for them but don't translate so well for everyday users, same with the installers but often do a great job of adding nice 'touches' here and there for pro users.

Due to the complexities of using Linux, widespread adoption is slow, therefore adoption in dev circles is slow etc...

But you knew that already

[Builder]

Or you could try the Dread Pirate Federighi's Tainted operating system, OS X. The UI is consistently great, there is a plethora and even a community around well-designed apps, and you can hack on the UNIX beneath it all day long if you so desire.

[Aryvandaar]

linux's main issue is documentation for issues. Its freaking brutal.

 

As someone who works in IT supports I get by perplexed reading this statement.  This is a factually incorrect statement. There is plenty of documentation, you have the man commando, and man online archives, wikis, forums and so on, just as with Windows. However, just as with Windows you have to know what to look for and how to search the net to get the best results.

 

There is also no proof that Windows is the best OS for gaming. Yes, it has the most games, but we don't have the numbers to decide which platform is more effective running native games. 

[Floppy Kant Fish]

As someone who works in IT supports I get by perplexed reading this statement.  This is a factually incorrect statement. There is plenty of documentation, you have the man commando, and man online archives, wikis, forums and so on, just as with Windows. However, just as with Windows you have to know what to look for and how to search the net to get the best results.

 

There is also no proof that Windows is the best OS for gaming. Yes, it has the most games, but we don't have the numbers to decide which platform is more effective running native games. 

 

Didn't even mention games, but Windows is the best for gaming because it has a massive install base = $$$$$$$$

^so thats my stand on that...

 

As someone who has used various linux distro's (Fedora is still my fav, ubuntu coming in at a somewhat distant second.) for about 5 years now; for programming. Its unacceptable to get the average user to use the terminal to fix their issues, I have come across issues where its a very uncommon issue and there is only one forum post on the issue that isn't helpful at all. I know plenty of people that have had similar situations happen to them. All i can recommend is to either reinstall (which is why i use VM's) or start blinding searching for what is causing the issue.

 

But, I must mention, I haven't had any crazy issues with the new Fedora or the one before it (20?), ubuntu can move over, I strongly believe Fedora has the best chance at catching an average consumer.

[ErickS89]

I use Gentoo Linux or build Linux from scratch for my web development needs, and use Cgywin for SSH.

Linux won't catch on unless there is a standard and Linux is really loosy goosy when it comes to package management even though portage just crushes everything or tar xvjf packagename sudo sh runscript.sh which also works.

[MEC-777]

Didn't even mention games, but Windows is the best for gaming because it has a massive install base = $$$$$$$$

^so thats my stand on that...

 

As someone who has used various linux distro's (Fedora is still my fav, ubuntu coming in at a somewhat distant second.) for about 5 years now; for programming. Its unacceptable to get the average user to use the terminal to fix their issues, I have come across issues where its a very uncommon issue and there is only one forum post on the issue that isn't helpful at all. I know plenty of people that have had similar situations happen to them. All i can recommend is to either reinstall (which is why i use VM's) or start blinding searching for what is causing the issue.

 

But, I must mention, I haven't had any crazy issues with the new Fedora or the one before it (20?), ubuntu can move over, I strongly believe Fedora has the best chance at catching an average consumer.

 

The "average user" shouldn't need to use terminal to fix their issues because the "average user" typically isn't doing anything unusual with their PC - mostly the basic stuff; email, browsing, youtube, netflix, word processing, spreadsheets, media playback, etc. All those mainstream functions typically run without any issues on most user-friendly distros. If they are doing other things with their PC and have special software needs (ei: video editing, heavy gaming etc.) then they aren't so much the "average user" and generally speaking, those type of people tend to have an above average working knowledge of PCs, hardware and software - to the extent that learning to use the terminal shouldn't be that big of an issue.

[MEC-777]

Logan had quite a bit of discussion about Linux in his latest video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eznIvga9C8A If you go to about 47:30 is where he really gets into it. He even talks quite a bit about using Linux for productive work and some of the alternate programs available (at the moment).

 

@LinusTech, even Logan thinks you should be getting more into it and that by avoiding it, you're not really doing your self or the tech community any favors by not exploring this very important area of computing. Ultimately, it's still your choice to decide what you want to do and I won't hold it against you, but at least give it some serious thought.

[Floppy Kant Fish]

The "average user" should need to use terminal to fix their issues because the "average user" typically isn't doing anything unusual with their PC - mostly the basic stuff; email, browsing, youtube, netflix, word processing, spreadsheets, media playback, etc. All those mainstream functions typically run without any issues on most user-friendly distros. If they are doing other things with their PC and have special software needs (ei: video editing, heavy gaming etc.) then they aren't so much the "average user" and generally speaking, those type of people tend to have an above average working knowledge of PCs, hardware and software - to the extent that learning to use the terminal shouldn't be that big of an issue.

I don't think you understand what I am saying. I am not arguing who the "average user" is.

You start out by saying "the "average user" should need to use terminal to fix their issues", then you say the, lets called it the 'power users', will have "an above average working knowledge" and then the "terminal shouldn't be that big of an issue".

Imagine trying to explain how to install Wine to get netflix to work (if thats still the only proper solution, IDK I haven't bothered cause Windows does it soooo much better). Its hopeless.