Best entry-level DSLR for video?

[Walter H.W.]

Hi guys,

 

I really want to buy a "good" camera so that I can make better videos, I've been looking around for quite some time but I only got more confused..

 

My budget is $600 (€500), please do not suggest more expensive combos cause I'm over my budget already

 

The last ones I've considered are the Nikon d3300 or d5200, Canon 600d (Rebel T3i) or 700d (Rebel T5i), plus a 50mm f/1.8 prime lens (suggested to me from Brandon Lee).

 

I'm open to consider any other camera as long as it is within the budget including the prime lens ($125).

 

Once again, it's mostly for videos.

 

 

 

 

Thanks!

[mosin40]

I will say the Cannon 600d will be sufficient

[Walter H.W.]

I will say the Cannon 600d will be sufficient

 

Yeah but the 700d has continuous autofocus while recording

 

By the way, can anyone explain me why the Nikon cameras have so much better specs in "Lower noise at high ISO" or "Better image quality" and other stuff than Canon, taken from the website called snapsort.com..

 

And also, do they matter in videos too?

[strawberrymaker]

650d 600d 550d are mid/entry dslr's with imo good lenses. may not the best but i can shoot all my pics with it and dont see a reason for another.

 

~Straw

[.spider.]

Canon video quality is in my opinion mostly poor except for 5DMKIII and 1D C

A VAF and MagicLantern RAW improof the quality a lot but the VAF is expensive and the raw recording and workflow is complicated.

I don't know about Nikon

[Walter H.W.]

650d 600d 550d are mid/entry dslr's with imo good lenses. may not the best but i can shoot all my pics with it and dont see a reason for another.

 

 

Ehm, Lenses aren't really what I'm worried about, I'll have a kit lens (if I buy a D3000 or 600D) and a 50mm f/1.8 lens (for sure), btw as I said I won't shoot pics with it but videos.

 

Canon video quality is in my opinion mostly poor except for 5DMKIII and 1D C

 

 

That's weird, I've always heard good things about Canon's video quality, but thanks anyway.

[FlamingDefibs]

That's weird, I've always heard good things about Canon's video quality, but thanks anyway.

 

Those things are mostly regurgitated word of mouth or simply a lack of any real comparisons, as Canon's lineup has been lacking for a while.

[Walter H.W.]

Those things are mostly regurgitated word of mouth or simply a lack of any real comparisons, as Canon's lineup has been lacking for a while.

 

Well, what do you suggest me then?

[.spider.]

That's weird, I've always heard good things about Canon's video quality, but thanks anyway.

Of course you can do a lot of nice shots because of the low dof but the h.264 encoder, antialiasing filter and downsampling aren't state of the art.

Maybe look for a Panasonic GH2 or GH3

[FlamingDefibs]

Well, what do you suggest me then?

 

Really, at that budget, the 600D already listed should be fine for most videos, and if I recall correctly, there are little to no sensor improvements between the canon T series, aka the 600D, 700D, etc. Though it's up to you if you want to get the 700D for continuous video autofocus.

 

Or, like the poster above me said, the Panasonic GH2 is a good option if you find a used one in your budget.

[Walter H.W.]

Of course you can do a lot of nice shots because of the low dof but the h.264 encoder, antialiasing filter and downsampling aren't state of the art.

Maybe look for a Panasonic GH2 or GH3

 

They're too expensive and MFT.. 

[Walter H.W.]

Really, at that budget, the 600D already listed should be fine for most videos, and if I recall correctly, there are little to no sensor improvements between the canon T series, aka the 600D, 700D, etc. Though it's up to you if you want to get the 700D for continuous video autofocus.

 

Or, like the poster above me said, the Panasonic GH2 is a good option if you find a used one in your budget.

 

I know, there are no sensor improvements from 600d to 700d but as you said it has continuous video autofocus and few other things.

http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon-600d-vs-Canon-EOS-700D

 

 

PS: I really don't wanna buy a used camera because I'm not even sure I'd notice if there are problems with it since I'm a newbie..

[FlamingDefibs]

I know, there are no sensor improvements from 600d to 700d but as you said it has continuous video autofocus and few other things.

http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon-600d-vs-Canon-EOS-700D

 

Like I said, it's up to you. I would go for the 700D if I didn't expect to upgrade anytime soon, and vice versa.

[Walter H.W.]

Like I said, it's up to you. I would go for the 700D if I didn't expect to upgrade anytime soon, and vice versa.

 

I guess so.

 

 

I'll wait to see if there's someone with experience on both brands (or others) who can really suggest me the best camera for that price.  :unsure:

[.spider.]

Don't forget when you make your decision there is http://www.magiclantern.fm/ which improves canon cameras a lot. 

[Walter H.W.]

Don't forget when you make your decision there is http://www.magiclantern.fm/ which improves canon cameras a lot. 

 

Wow, that software is amazing! Makes me wanna buy a Canon just for that .

If I end up buying one, what do you think I should change to improve the quality?

[DoubleY]

Wow, that software is amazing! Makes me wanna buy a Canon just for that .

If I end up buying one, what do you think I should change to improve the quality?

You want to buy a Canon camera just to put a 3rd party firmware on it? Okey...

[.spider.]

Increasing the bitrate of the h.264 encoding (quality improvement isn't so big)

Turn on Digic Peeking which increases the sharpness of parts of the image which are in focus so its easier to focus manually.

You could also try MagicLantern Raw which gives you uncompressed 14bit 720p24 continuous recording on 650D and 700D with 45MB/s SD Cards. Sadly the autofocus sensors* are causing dots in the picture but its easy to get rid of them the but you lose some resolution in the red and blue color channels. Shouldn't be such a problem since almost everything is using 4:2:0 subsampling anyways.

*On the CMOS are AF sensors for focusing while filming

FPS override for time lapse.

For taking pictures:

Histogram based on real sensor data.

DualIso for a higher dynamic range

And after the fun stuff, yes MagicLantern could fry your camera but I only heard about 3 bricked Cameras and I think this happened while developing Magic Lantern.

[Walter H.W.]

You want to buy a Canon camera just to put a 3rd party firmware on it? Okey...

This is helpful how?

Obviously I was joking and I wrote in my first post what I'm looking for.

Increasing the bitrate of the h.264 encoding (quality improvement isn't so big)

Turn on Digic Peeking which increases the sharpness of parts of the image which are in focus so its easier to focus manually.

You could also try MagicLantern Raw which gives you uncompressed 14bit 720p24 continuous recording on 650D and 700D with 45MB/s SD Cards. Sadly the autofocus sensors* are causing dots in the picture but its easy to get rid of them the but you lose some resolution in the red and blue color channels. Shouldn't be such a problem since almost everything is using 4:2:0 subsampling anyways.

*On the CMOS are AF sensors for focusing while filming

FPS override for time lapse.

For taking pictures:

Histogram based on real sensor data.

DualIso for a higher dynamic range

And after the fun stuff, yes MagicLantern could fry your camera but I only heard about 3 bricked Cameras and I think this happened while developing Magic Lantern.

Ok, thanks man, even though I'd rather not shoot in 720p but anyway.

I've seen some videos about ML.

Do you perhaps know if on the 700D it has to be installed voiding the warranty or it can just run off of the SD card, like I've seen in another video.

[.spider.]

720p RAW upscaled to 1080p looks better than Canon's 1080p h264 especially after grading.

Magic Lantern always runs from the SD Card but first time using it, it opens the boot loader.

AFAIK most Canon service points aren't having any problem to repair a Camera which boot loader was opened.

As long as the camera's electronic is intact you can close the boot loader.

[Walter H.W.]

720p RAW upscaled to 1080p looks better than Canon's 1080p h264 especially after grading.

 

Oh, that's weird.

You sound like you're an expert about this software, do you regularly use it? Also you told me that Canon's video quality is poor but you still suggest me or it's like "I don't think quality is good but it's still better than what I haven't tried"? I hope you get what I mean.

 

Btw today I went to a "real" shop and tried them out, I've to say the 700D looked a bit more professional than the others (it also had some expensive heavy lens on) and the Nikon D3300 looked like a toy. Plus they all look kinda small for my long fingers but I guess I can't get bigger cameras at that price point. The 60d felt better in my hands but of course it costs more (new). 

[.spider.]

I'm using Magic Lantern for 1.5 years on my 650D

Its difficult to say but imo canons dslr video function is not worth the price if you won't take pictures with it.

Exept you want to take cinematic shots with low dof and you don't care so much about the overall video quality.

[DoubleY]

This is helpful how?

Nowhere in your asinine comment did I see a "loljk" nor anything that hints at it. 

[Walter H.W.]

I'm using Magic Lantern for 1.5 years on my 650D

Its difficult to say but imo canons dslr video function is not worth the price if you won't take pictures with it.

Exept you want to take cinematic shots with low dof and you don't care so much about the overall video quality.

 

Well, Brandon Lee aka B-roll suggested to me the 600d and I suppose he knows something about video.

I don't know about the rest, what's why I'm asking

 

Nowhere in your asinine comment did I see a "loljk" nor anything that hints at it.

 

I put a ":D" at the end of my comment, then it's your brain that has to get the joke.

Anyway I don't get why you're posting here if you're not helping, you can keep your flaming comments for yourself.

Thanks.

[Razor512]

In terms of sensors, the canon crop sensors are still pretty far behind the current sony sensors

 

e.g., compare canons best crop sensor camera (recently released 7D mk2), to the entry level nikon D3300.

http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Compare/Side-by-side/Canon-EOS-7D-Mark-II-versus-Nikon-D3300___977_928

 

The main reason why canon is so popular with video is in the past, they were the only ones offering decent video capabilities (most other companies were offing basic video with little to no manual controls)

 

While other companies eventually caught up with the manual controls, the open source community, took canon even further e.g., with magic lantern, you are able to achieve end results that you simply cannot achieve, even with the highest end Nikon DSLR.

Magic lantern is probably the biggest selling point for canon crop sensor cameras now. and if it is released for the 7D mk 2, it will likely dominate the independent film space (if their storage controller can do over 100MB/s), as it will mean 1080p raw video at over 30FPS. That will mean essentially having close to the post processing latitude found in cameras such as the RED epic, but at a lower resolution.  The main bottleneck when recording raw video, is the storage controller, on the lower end crop sensor cameras, it is often 45-50MB/s while a camera such as the 5D mk 3 may push 90+MB/s

 

It all depends on how far you are willing to take your post processing. If all you are planing to do is set the basic manual controls, hit record, and then cut together a few clips and probably perform some basic color correction if needed, then you are better off with going with a Nikon crop sensor camera that offers all of the manual video controls that you need, as you will get cleaner video out of it due to the lower noise levels.

 

DXO mark ISO tests measure the cameras ability to retain fine detail, at the max listed ISO, you pretty much have little to no fine detail remaining, and any fine detail that you think is there, is an illusion that you are getting from the fine grain in the photo (basically details that are visible at the lowest native ISO, that are no longer visible at at the cutoff point that they list, when all of that detail is gone,  you have essentially lost part of the image and that is transition marks the highest ISO for taking detailed low light images.