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LG: OLED can become cheaper than LCD

Notional

OLED for cheap!

 

LG, the biggest OLED maker in the tv industry, has given some insight into the state of production, that is not only good news, but very exiting to the future of our home entertainment.

 

It is tempting to conclude the the huge price drop from 15,000 US dollars at the time of launch to less than 3,000 US dollars now is motivated by bad sales numbers. But LG tells us that the story is quite different.

The dizzying price drop is an effect of drastic improvements in production efficiency. In the early days, LG had very low production yields at around 20-30%, meaning that only 20-30% of all OLED TVs produced could be sold. At IFA, LG told us that production yields have now reached 80%, which is why LG is able to sell an OLED TV for less than 3,000 dollars.

 

Due to the huge increase in yields, LG believes TV sales will be 50/50 OLED and LCD in just 3 years.

 

By the time LG hits 95% yields, the company should be able to produce OLED TVs at lower production costs than LCD TVs - if everything goes according to plan that is.

 

55EC9300-3.jpg?1405620309

 

Why should I care about OLED?

 

Just a few quick bulletpoints for those who don't know about OLED:

  • No backlight bleeding, as each OLED (sub)pixel creates its own light.
  • Perfect blacks. A subpixel will shut off and emit no light, when displaying perfect black. This gives a theoretical contrast ratio that is unlimited.
  • No black crush, as the darkest gray gradients can be perfect, so full detail in very dark scenes.
  • Extremely low response time. Theoretically it can go under 0,01 ms. Enjoy your perfect 10.000 fps.
  • Panels are only 1mm thick. A 55" OLED tv can be made just 4mm thick.
  • Perfect viewing angles with no colour distortion.

Personal take:

 

This is amazing news. It is obvious, that LG's strategy of using white OLED's with passive colour filters, is cheaper, easier and more reliant (colours fade at same "half life"), than Samsungs RGB OLED's. This is probably also the reason why Samsung has chosen to leave the OLED tv marked for the time being. Another theory could be that Samsung is reconstructing their production to make white OLED's with passive colour filters, now that Samsung and LG has chosen to stop their OLED patent fights, and instead share their OLED patent.

 

With the debut of a mass production 4k OLED tv from LG this year, we can hope, that the OLED tech is now starting to mature enough to support the high DPI, necessary for our pc monitors. Personally my dream monitor is a 3440x1440 OLED, Adaptive Sync supported monitor in this form:

LG-34UC97.jpg

 

 

Sources:

http://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1411039923 LG: OLED can be cheaper than LCD

http://www.engadget.com/2013/09/24/samsung-and-lg-settle-lcd-oled-patent-dispute-choose-to-focus/ Samsung and LG settle patent disputes

Watching Intel have competition is like watching a headless chicken trying to get out of a mine field

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As always, eventually due to better production procedés and manufacturer effeciency OLED will become cheaper than LCD. Just like something like Flash storage (Sd cards/USB sticks.) have become much cheaper. This is usually the case with any product, have a look at these:

productlifecycle.png

and

fwk-tanner-fig02_017.jpg

 

 

 

Hope I helped some people understand this kind of stuff more :D.

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Good, can't wait to get a 4k oled 65" tv when it's cheaper :D

Don't ask to ask, just ask... please 🤨

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yes I have been waiting for this sense 2011 at 3000dollars I could afford that :D no sarcasm might take a few weeks

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We all new that since the first oleds apparition on CES, when they explained all of this stuff. One of the most important points made were the decrease in cost.

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Nice! Now give me 32:9 1440p monitor with OLED (27" 2x2560*1440) with GSync AdaptiveSync and I won't ever leave my home again.

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This is awesome news. I would love an OLED for watching movies on. You'd turn off the light and all you'd be able to see would be the picture...eeexcelent! I would also love some OLED monitors. I would imagine the colour accuracy would be near perfect. :)

ON A 7 MONTH BREAK FROM THESE LTT FORUMS. WILL BE BACK ON NOVEMBER 5th.


Advisor in the 'Displays' Sub-forum | Sony Vegas Pro Enthusiast & Advisor


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@SSOB Yeah nice simple product life cycle. The news about this, is HOW fast this is going at the moment. Hopefully this will give us OLED monitors very soon.

 

@WereCat G-sync is basically dead the second Adaptive Sync hits the marked Q1 2015 http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/217463-industrys-biggest-scaler-vendors-pledge-support-for-amds-project-freesync/

Not because G-sync is inherently worse than AS, but because it is proprietary and very expensive to implement. Hopefully Nvidia will support AS in their drivers next year, making G-sync 100% redundant.

Watching Intel have competition is like watching a headless chicken trying to get out of a mine field

CPU: Intel I7 4790K@4.6 with NZXT X31 AIO; MOTHERBOARD: ASUS Z97 Maximus VII Ranger; RAM: 8 GB Kingston HyperX 1600 DDR3; GFX: ASUS R9 290 4GB; CASE: Lian Li v700wx; STORAGE: Corsair Force 3 120GB SSD; Samsung 850 500GB SSD; Various old Seagates; PSU: Corsair RM650; MONITOR: 2x 20" Dell IPS; KEYBOARD/MOUSE: Logitech K810/ MX Master; OS: Windows 10 Pro

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I think watching anything on an OLED TV would replicate almost exactly how you'd see the thing you're watching

in real life. Pretty cool. I've seen an OLED TV in person and they are a movie lovers dream IMO. :)

ON A 7 MONTH BREAK FROM THESE LTT FORUMS. WILL BE BACK ON NOVEMBER 5th.


Advisor in the 'Displays' Sub-forum | Sony Vegas Pro Enthusiast & Advisor


  Tech Tips Christian Fellowship Founder & Coordinator 

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@SSOB Yeah nice simple product life cycle. The news about this, is HOW fast this is going at the moment. Hopefully this will give us OLED monitors very soon.

 

@WereCat G-sync is basically dead the second Adaptive Sync hits the marked Q1 2015 http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/217463-industrys-biggest-scaler-vendors-pledge-support-for-amds-project-freesync/

Not because G-sync is inherently worse than AS, but because it is proprietary and very expensive to implement. Hopefully Nvidia will support AS in their drivers next year, making G-sync 100% redundant.

Even LG doesn't even know how fast it will go. We just have to wait as with everything. My estimation would be 5 years untill it goes mainstream like LED tv is today. In about 2-3 years it will reach cross -price elasticity of a luxurious product so people with an average-high/high income will be able to afford it. Again all my estimation based of history and what I know about technology/economics.

Interested in Business and Technology

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I'm probably going to buy a curved 4k tv from samsung in a couple years.

Unless they have curved 4k OLED tvs by then, I will be sticking to LED.

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Even LG doesn't even know how fast it will go. We just have to wait as with everything. My estimation would be 5 years untill it goes mainstream like LED tv is today. In about 2-3 years it will reach cross -price elasticity of a luxurious product so people with an average-high/high income will be able to afford it. Again all my estimation based of history and what I know about technology/economics.

Well LG does themselves estimate 50/50 between OLED and LCD tv's in just 3 years. If that is across ALL tv's sold from LG, that would mean that most middle and all highend tv's will be OLED in just 3 years. We are apparently just 15%points from cheaper developments costs; which should be achievable in less than 5 years it seems. Depending on the definition of mainstream, I think it will be just a couple of years from now. 

Watching Intel have competition is like watching a headless chicken trying to get out of a mine field

CPU: Intel I7 4790K@4.6 with NZXT X31 AIO; MOTHERBOARD: ASUS Z97 Maximus VII Ranger; RAM: 8 GB Kingston HyperX 1600 DDR3; GFX: ASUS R9 290 4GB; CASE: Lian Li v700wx; STORAGE: Corsair Force 3 120GB SSD; Samsung 850 500GB SSD; Various old Seagates; PSU: Corsair RM650; MONITOR: 2x 20" Dell IPS; KEYBOARD/MOUSE: Logitech K810/ MX Master; OS: Windows 10 Pro

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I'm probably going to buy a curved 4k tv from samsung in a couple years.

Unless they have curved 4k OLED tvs by then, I will be sticking to LED.

 

Well Samsung is not in the OLED TV business at the moment. Hopefulle they are going to make white OLED tv's to compete with LG within the next year or two. But right now, LG's OLED tv's are essentially on a natural monopolistic market (if you only want OLED that is, otherwise it's a monopolistic competition).

 

Although I am really intrigued by curved 21:9 monitors, I think they are dumb and impractical for TV's. What do you see in them?

Watching Intel have competition is like watching a headless chicken trying to get out of a mine field

CPU: Intel I7 4790K@4.6 with NZXT X31 AIO; MOTHERBOARD: ASUS Z97 Maximus VII Ranger; RAM: 8 GB Kingston HyperX 1600 DDR3; GFX: ASUS R9 290 4GB; CASE: Lian Li v700wx; STORAGE: Corsair Force 3 120GB SSD; Samsung 850 500GB SSD; Various old Seagates; PSU: Corsair RM650; MONITOR: 2x 20" Dell IPS; KEYBOARD/MOUSE: Logitech K810/ MX Master; OS: Windows 10 Pro

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Well LG does themselves estimate 50/50 between OLED and LCD tv's in just 3 years. If that is across ALL tv's sold from LG, that would mean that most middle and all highend tv's will be OLED in just 3 years. We are apparently just 15%points from cheaper developments costs; which should be achievable in less than 5 years it seems. Depending on the definition of mainstream, I think it will be just a couple of years from now. 

I dont believe this. For me mainstream for a television is around the €500-700 mark. You can pick up great 46'' LED (IPS/PLS of course.) FullHD television with SmartTV functionalities for under €700,-. Basically mainstream is whatever price catagory is sold the most. When it comes to cars That would be C-D segment so around €30K/35K. I don't think OLED will be mainstream for at least five years. But if it happens earlier than its great for us, the consumers. It will all depend on the first two companies who can make their production so efficient that they can produce for the same price per product as now or less. When let's say LG can only master this of course it will NEVER go mainstream because they can ask a premium forever, this is extremely unlikely to happen tho so don't worry about that monopoly position.

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Well Samsung is not in the OLED TV business at the moment. Hopefulle they are going to make white OLED tv's to compete with LG within the next year or two. But right now, LG's OLED tv's are essentially on a natural monopolistic market (if you only want OLED that is, otherwise it's a monopolistic competition).

 

Although I am really intrigued by curved 21:9 monitors, I think they are dumb and impractical for TV's. What do you see in them?

I'm not looking at 21:9 tvs, just the regular 16:9 4k with the slight curve.

 

I use my TV as a monitor, and 99% of the time it's only me looking at it exactly centered. I like this option because its basically the same size as a wall of 6 monitors, but the wall of 6 is 6x harder to run, plus it has bezels.

Also, wall of 6 has the side monitors at a slight angle towards you, which is similar to having the curved tv. :)

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I dont believe this. For me mainstream for a television is around the €500-700 mark. You can pick up great 46'' LED (IPS/PLS of course.) FullHD television with SmartTV functionalities for under €700,-. Basically mainstream is whatever price catagory is sold the most. When it comes to cars That would be C-D segment so around €30K/35K. I don't think OLED will be mainstream for at least five years. But if it happens earlier than its great for us, the consumers. It will all depend on the first two companies who can make their production so efficient that they can produce for the same price per product as now or less. When let's say LG can only master this of course it will NEVER go mainstream because they can ask a premium forever, this is extremely unlikely to happen tho so don't worry about that monopoly position.

 

By that definition of mainstream, I completely agree with you. I doubt OLED will be priced that low (and maybe size wise as well) for quite a few years. Mainstream is relative, as the 8000 series is the most sold Samsung tv here in Denmark, and therefore "mainstream" here, though being an expensive tv. But I see your point.

 

However, IF LG can manufacture their OLED panels cheaper than LCD, and have them weigh less as well (transport accumulate a LOT internationally, to the end user), I do think LG will prefer to just fade out LCD, simply for the saved production and transport costs, instead of trying to keep a premium price. But I suspect, they will do both at the same time, as a kind of a compromise.

 

I'm not looking at 21:9 tvs, just the regular 16:9 4k with the slight curve.

 

I use my TV as a monitor, and 99% of the time it's only me looking at it exactly centered. I like this option because its basically the same size as a wall of 6 monitors, but the wall of 6 is 6x harder to run, plus it has bezels.

Also, wall of 6 has the side monitors at a slight angle towards you, which is similar to having the curved tv. :)

Ah ok, that makes perfect sense. That is the same reason I am interested in curved panels; because of monitors. I look forward to Linus' review of LG's new curved 34" 21:9 monitor for his view on the curve.

Watching Intel have competition is like watching a headless chicken trying to get out of a mine field

CPU: Intel I7 4790K@4.6 with NZXT X31 AIO; MOTHERBOARD: ASUS Z97 Maximus VII Ranger; RAM: 8 GB Kingston HyperX 1600 DDR3; GFX: ASUS R9 290 4GB; CASE: Lian Li v700wx; STORAGE: Corsair Force 3 120GB SSD; Samsung 850 500GB SSD; Various old Seagates; PSU: Corsair RM650; MONITOR: 2x 20" Dell IPS; KEYBOARD/MOUSE: Logitech K810/ MX Master; OS: Windows 10 Pro

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@SSOB Yeah nice simple product life cycle. The news about this, is HOW fast this is going at the moment. Hopefully this will give us OLED monitors very soon.

@WereCat G-sync is basically dead the second Adaptive Sync hits the marked Q1 2015 http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/217463-industrys-biggest-scaler-vendors-pledge-support-for-amds-project-freesync/

Not because G-sync is inherently worse than AS, but because it is proprietary and very expensive to implement. Hopefully Nvidia will support AS in their drivers next year, making G-sync 100% redundant.

GS is not dead. We are just assuming that it will die after AS will become available. NVIDIA may still decide to go full retard and not support it like they did with PhysX if you have both AMD and NVIDIA GPU installed in your PC.
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WTH is this some sort of troll teasing by LG?

 

I cant bother to read all that but,  will it become cheaper or it CAN? what does it mean it can? why wouldnt they become cheaper if its posible?

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As always, eventually due to better production procedés and manufacturer effeciency OLED will become cheaper than LCD. Just like something like Flash storage (Sd cards/USB sticks.) have become much cheaper. This is usually the case with any product, have a look at these:

productlifecycle.png

 

Hope I helped some people understand this kind of stuff more :D.

 

 

Sony's always the blue line. As they are with OLED.

5800X3D - RTX 4070 - 2K @ 165Hz

 

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Sony's always the blue line. As they are with OLED.

I like how your title says Sony enthusiast , Please just put ''Sony is life'' there xD

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OLED is the god of display technology.

Imagine having a 4k 10-bit OLED >60Hz monitor. And OLED screens have very low input lag, so you'll have amazing colors with a high refresh rate and low input lag... Perfect for both gaming and picture editing stuff.

ilt.gif

✌ (≧◉◡◉≦)✌

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[*]Extremely low response time. Theoretically it can go under 0,01 ms. Enjoy your perfect 10.000 fps.

OLED TV's has been tested and showes that so far, released panels don't offer any better input lag than LED's.

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OLED TV's has been tested and showes that so far, released panels don't offer any better input lag than LED's.

Input lag is caused by the display controller (scaler) and has nothing to do with response time. LG has been reusing their LED TV controllers, introducing some LED specific issues on OLED tv's that should not exist. Hopefully LG will make better controllers for their OLED's. We will see if they have already with the new OLED tv's this year. 

Watching Intel have competition is like watching a headless chicken trying to get out of a mine field

CPU: Intel I7 4790K@4.6 with NZXT X31 AIO; MOTHERBOARD: ASUS Z97 Maximus VII Ranger; RAM: 8 GB Kingston HyperX 1600 DDR3; GFX: ASUS R9 290 4GB; CASE: Lian Li v700wx; STORAGE: Corsair Force 3 120GB SSD; Samsung 850 500GB SSD; Various old Seagates; PSU: Corsair RM650; MONITOR: 2x 20" Dell IPS; KEYBOARD/MOUSE: Logitech K810/ MX Master; OS: Windows 10 Pro

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WANT 32" 4K calibrated 240hz monitors! OLED!

If you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life thinking it's stupid.  - Albert Einstein

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Input lag is caused by the display controller (scaler) and has nothing to do with response time. LG has been reusing their LED TV controllers, introducing some LED specific issues on OLED tv's that should not exist. Hopefully LG will make better controllers for their OLED's. We will see if they have already with the new OLED tv's this year.

Yeah I know, just putting it out there.
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